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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
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    Monmouth Beach, NJ
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    Tourism is good for the local economy. You've got your head in the sand if you don't believe it. So yea... wide beaches are a shot in the economic arm for almost everybody... from the corner market, to the local barber, to the pizzeria down the street. Plus the summer jobs for the groms... plus tackle shops... plus the bathing pavilions... the list goes on. I have nothing against big, sandy beaches.

    I have something against the way they're being created, which is without regard to ecology, habitat and recreation - specifically surfing and fishing. The way to address all of this is clearly well engineered artificial reef systems. They can protect property, stabilize the shoreline, AND provide habitat for fish and those other scaly, crusty animals... surfers. We need to look at natural shorelines that maintain a state of dynamic equilibrium and re-create that as accurately as possible. The damage was done a long time ago, when we developed the coastline. Now we need to push engineering forward, into the future to solve the problem, because we can't go back.

    But we have this crazy aversion to change, and keep clinging hopelessly to what's familiar, without regard to efficacy. We just pump the beaches and plan on coming back in another 5-7 years. Lets face it... most people don't fish, and don't surf, so most people don't care. Ignorance is bliss. Artificial reefs are not some radical concept that's never been tested. It's the typical, "business as usual" approach that's killing us.
    Last edited by LBCrew; Oct 8, 2011 at 01:53 AM.

  2. #32
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    Aug 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by zrich View Post
    Beach replenishment may or may not be a necessary evil, but jobs that don't add value don't keep the economy going. Now, we can argue whether or not these jobs add value due to the whole no tourism with no beach issue, but put that issue aside for the moment. Paying people to move sand around every few years does NOT add value to the economy. It simply takes money from one place (i.e. tax payers) and moves it somewhere else (i.e. the people moving sand). While that may be better for the people moving sand, on the whole, these types of things destroy value in an economy. A more permanent solution is in order as you mention, cgilhorn.
    Yeah...because it takes $32 billion dollars a year to do beach nourishment...

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    mantoloking
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    If a replenished beach is the only thing to wash away during a storm, then the beach replenishment was successful. Had a beach not been there in the first place properties behind the beach would likely suffer more damage. It's easier on the properties to keep replacing the beach than otherwise. It also helps with tourism to have a nice wide sandy beach. A lot of people like to sunbathe, even though the ozone layer is damaged, and those people bring a lot of money to the shore towns. If you're not happy with beach replenishment, buy a house between Mantoloking and Seaside. We haven't had replenishment here since the 1962 storm, I believe, so even though our waves here are still closed out junk most of the time, at least you will never have to witness sand burying a spectacular break.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Atlantic Ocean
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    261
    Breaks don't always come right back after a big storm.... Think of the cove at Sandy Hook SP which will never be the same...Think of 7th Street in OCNJ...

    They may never come back.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by dudeman View Post
    Breaks don't always come right back after a big storm.... Think of the cove at Sandy Hook SP which will never be the same...Think of 7th Street in OCNJ...

    They may never come back.

    Just curious? When was 7th Street in its prime?

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
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    Ocean County NJ
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    Thanks for posting my comment Capt Jaq. That was me who wrote the stuff about “pissing into the wind”. Here’s some more of what I think about beach replenishment.
    Let’s talk about a place familiar to us all; Hawaii, more specifically Oahu’s north shore. They don’t partake in “beach replenishment”, their homes are right on the beach, and there aren’t any sand dunes or jetties. They have large, powerful surf most of the year (10-20ft+ surf is common). In Oahu the big waves break on various reefs. Despite the consistently heavy surf, homes and beaches remain intact. Local business thrives and also remains unaffected. Clearly the reefs are what keep everything in check.
    As surfers we know you can’t fight the sea in any way because you lose every time. Working with the ways of the sea is a different story. Like I said before, the ENGINEERS are “pissing into the wind” with millions of our tax dollars. It’s sad and it’s f##king dumb. If they just did a bit of research and looked around the world at how the ocean actually works they could save millions of our TAX dollars. Instead teachers, cops, and firemen are losing their jobs while millions of dollars are pissed away “replenishing sand”. They should be ashamed.

  7. #37
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    Sep 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by dudeman View Post
    Breaks don't always come right back after a big storm.... Think of the cove at Sandy Hook SP which will never be the same...Think of 7th Street in OCNJ...

    They may never come back.
    7th street is indefinetly screwed. That break hasn't been actually breaking for years now, 8th street isn't much better

  8. #38
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    Sep 2008
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    VA BEACH
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug View Post
    Thanks for posting my comment Capt Jaq. That was me who wrote the stuff about “pissing into the wind”. Here’s some more of what I think about beach replenishment.
    Let’s talk about a place familiar to us all; Hawaii, more specifically Oahu’s north shore. They don’t partake in “beach replenishment”, their homes are right on the beach, and there aren’t any sand dunes or jetties. They have large, powerful surf most of the year (10-20ft+ surf is common). In Oahu the big waves break on various reefs. Despite the consistently heavy surf, homes and beaches remain intact. Local business thrives and also remains unaffected. Clearly the reefs are what keep everything in check.
    As surfers we know you can’t fight the sea in any way because you lose every time. Working with the ways of the sea is a different story. Like I said before, the ENGINEERS are “pissing into the wind” with millions of our tax dollars. It’s sad and it’s f##king dumb. If they just did a bit of research and looked around the world at how the ocean actually works they could save millions of our TAX dollars. Instead teachers, cops, and firemen are losing their jobs while millions of dollars are pissed away “replenishing sand”. They should be ashamed.
    I think their reefs may help keep the sand from getting sucked out so much...I could be wrong?

  9. #39
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    Aug 2009
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    Monmouth Beach, NJ
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug View Post
    Despite the consistently heavy surf, homes and beaches remain intact. Local business thrives and also remains unaffected. Clearly the reefs are what keep everything in check.
    Exactly... The concept, distilled down to the most basic element, is (and we all know this) you can't fight nature. You have to go with it. Looking at natural, dynamic ecosystems as models, we need to re-create as best we can what works naturally. Nature does not dredge sand in once place and plop it down in another. The movement of sand is seasonally rhythmic and predictable. We need to engineer a shoreline stabilization program that works with this process, not against it. This means multiple reefs of appropriate size and orientation, designed specifically for each location in need of protection.

    The saddest thing is... there IS a solution. It's just a bit too far out of our comfort zone to implement at this time. Maybe the next generation will be more progressive thinkers.

    Get this... the Army Corps of Engineers, the ones who designed and built the seawalls and jetties and groins, and the ones now in charge of designing our current beach replenishment programs, had this to say in a final report back in the mid 90's:

    "According to the Army Corps of Engineers, the most important cause of human-induced erosion is interruption of sediment sources and longshore sediment transport. Examples include the armoring of sediment sources with seawalls, revetments, and bulkheads, and the interruption of longshore sediment transport by the construction of groins and jetties."

    OK... so let's let these geniuses keep doing what they're doing, and see what happens in another 50 years.
    Last edited by LBCrew; Oct 9, 2011 at 02:05 PM.

  10. #40
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    Feb 2010
    Location
    Outer Banks NC
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    Beach replenishment definetly changes where the waves break and that sucks at first but thwaves come back even better after a time, albiet maybe a different spot. Thats how beach breaks work even without replenishment. The money spent on these projects is beleive it or not a drop in the bucket. The broader beaches are worth it. The real solution is protective artificial reefs. Unfortunatly you would have to drop miles and miles of rock offshore to really make a difference. It not really possible. The army corps knows the sand wil wash away reletively quickly. Its really a condition of coastal development and maintenance thereof. Support these kinds of efforts and you end up getting a permanent sand pumping system like in Kirra, Australia. Their project has its own website. Present that kind of info to local commissioners and you might have a superbank of your own in your backyard. Be part of a solution instead of *****ing.