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  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by zrich View Post
    Seriously? Can you please provide sources for all the "stats" you quote.

    I'm not arguing that illegal immigration isn't an issue that needs to be addressed (I don't think it's "the real problem with the country"), but how exactly do you go about arresting illegals? Ask anyone who isn't white for their papers? Maybe we can just hire some old Stasi officers from WWII Germany to start this program. In NYC, if you're arrested and undocumented, you are immediately referred to ICE. Arrested...not convicted. You could be an 18 yr old kid whose family moved here when you were 3 and be wrongfully arrested and then deported. Sounds reasonable, right?

    We need immigration because our population growth is slowing. Without adding to our population, we won't be able to afford the Ponzi scheme known as Social Security. Deporting all illegals would cost much more than giving them resident status and getting them to pay taxes. Sensible immigration reform is needed, but don't look for it from the current cast of buffoons we have in Congress.

    And by the way, hundreds of thousands of illegals are deported every year - http://www.ice.gov/news/releases/111...shingtondc.htm
    The south park episode was funny but in reality they are taking jobs. People were making a higher wage at skilled trade jobs. Companies hire illegals at a much lower rate. The people have a life based on their cost of living and a higher wage. They can't afford to take the lower paying job. So there are forced to go on employment or other social services (welfare). The illegal is working under the table but still able to get free housing, welfare, etc. That illegal is a huge tax burden and has made the skilled trademan a tax burden. You can probably search PBS for the show. There are also stats all over the internet and just a little common sense.

    The people who aren't against deporting illegals or not allowing them to have services paid by us are the ones who benefit from them (own company hiring them or there corporation is affected by an industry will make larger profits because of illegals).

  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by ragdolling View Post
    Total cost of illegal immigrants on the US economy (according to the restrictionist Federation for Immigration Reform) $114 billion per year
    Total cost of obesity on the US economy: (according to the US Center for Disease Control and Prevention) $147 billion a year.

    So, barrels4liam, are you even more pissed about fat people?
    LOL. Yes, the obesity cost is primarily for healthcare. I'm also annoyed with how fat people pay the same insurance costs as a healthy person. Premiums need to be increased for obese people, people who smoke. Why should a healthy person pay the same premium as someone with higher risks of diabetes, stroke, etc.

    The illegal figure is probably almost 5 times that though. They are only tracking illegals that they know about. We all know there are far more than that. Also, sponsors in the US that are harboring them are also adding to that figure.

  3. #103
    They are taking jobs, but in a lot of cases it's our own fault. They aren't taking jobs for $5 an hour anymore... Take electricians. Unin electricians on LI make mid $40's and hoiur + benefits + vacation. For a contractor to pay them he has to bill customers $95 an hour per man. Illegals and American non-union guys know this and work ask for $30 an hour , so contractors end up going non-union. They know what the union contractors have to bill at so they can charge a little less and make a lot more.
    The unions know this is happening , but they won't take a few dollars less even though it would mean a lot more work. They actually still want more money even though no contractor can compete.
    I

    Quote Originally Posted by barrels4liam View Post
    The south park episode was funny but in reality they are taking jobs. People were making a higher wage at skilled trade jobs. Companies hire illegals at a much lower rate. The people have a life based on their cost of living and a higher wage. They can't afford to take the lower paying job. So there are forced to go on employment or other social services (welfare). The illegal is working under the table but still able to get free housing, welfare, etc. That illegal is a huge tax burden and has made the skilled trademan a tax burden. You can probably search PBS for the show. There are also stats all over the internet and just a little common sense.

    The people who aren't against deporting illegals or not allowing them to have services paid by us are the ones who benefit from them (own company hiring them or there corporation is affected by an industry will make larger profits because of illegals).

  4. #104
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    The south park episode was funny but in reality they are taking jobs. People were making a higher wage at skilled trade jobs. Companies hire illegals at a much lower rate. The people have a life based on their cost of living and a higher wage. They can't afford to take the lower paying job. So there are forced to go on employment or other social services (welfare). The illegal is working under the table but still able to get free housing, welfare, etc. That illegal is a huge tax burden and has made the skilled trademan a tax burden. You can probably search PBS for the show. There are also stats all over the internet and just a little common sense.

    The people who aren't against deporting illegals or not allowing them to have services paid by us are the ones who benefit from them (own company hiring them or there corporation is affected by an industry will make larger profits because of illegals).
    I'm not disputing that illegals are an issue and that our immigration policy needs to be fixed. I am disputing what you tout as stats from a PBS show. How big of a problem is this really? I don't know, but there are millions of cases of people losing jobs every year in this country. Some are due to illegals, some are due to technological advancements, some are new products, some due to relocation of manufacturing, some due to other factors. Should we make technological advancement illegal because it costs people jobs and puts them on welfare?

    How much do you think it will cost to deport every illegal? We spent $18B last year to remove some 400K illegals - that works out to $45K/illegal deported. Estimates seem to range from 7-20M illegals. Extrapolate that $45K and you're looking at $315-900B. Personally, I just don't think that's economically feasible in the current economy. I don't agree with providing services people who exploit the system, but there are plenty of US citizens that fall into that category as well as illegal immigrants.

  5. #105
    And where do those stats come from? How does it cost $45k to throw a guy over a fence?


    Quote Originally Posted by zrich View Post
    I'm not disputing that illegals are an issue and that our immigration policy needs to be fixed. I am disputing what you tout as stats from a PBS show. How big of a problem is this really? I don't know, but there are millions of cases of people losing jobs every year in this country. Some are due to illegals, some are due to technological advancements, some are new products, some due to relocation of manufacturing, some due to other factors. Should we make technological advancement illegal because it costs people jobs and puts them on welfare?

    How much do you think it will cost to deport every illegal? We spent $18B last year to remove some 400K illegals - that works out to $45K/illegal deported. Estimates seem to range from 7-20M illegals. Extrapolate that $45K and you're looking at $315-900B. Personally, I just don't think that's economically feasible in the current economy. I don't agree with providing services people who exploit the system, but there are plenty of US citizens that fall into that category as well as illegal immigrants.

  6. #106
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
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    Gtown TEXAS BABY!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippy View Post
    Careful Liam, someone will pull out the racist moniker to stifle your right of free expression.
    Geez last I left this thread it was 7 pgs. Lol damn I gotta get caught up! Now we got racism!?

  7. #107
    First and foremost, good on the guy for climbing the coaster. Jersey and NY need help, and anything which keeps the cameras rolling up there is right to me.

    You guys should really chill on the politics, it’s a total waste of energy. I mean, really? You’re swallowing that pill still? That’s what the pigs in power want, for us to bicker over what side is right as they stuff their pockets with our money. No side is right. They are both wrong. Way wrong. Why? Look at their paycheck, and then look at yours. Then look up the definition of the word “complacent.”

    The country is so ****ed up because most of the people in it live beyond their means, so if you want to blame somebody, blame your neighbor who has racked up $150,000 worth of debt that they’ll never pay, yet still drives a 5 series BMW. Status trumps sanity these days.

    The rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer, that’s the reality, and it’s sad. Been that way for the past decade, I know, I’ve been living hand-to-mouth the whole time. Until people wise up and lead a more salubrious and simple life, it’s not going to change. No matter how much a politician talks about change, the bottom line is that they do not have that power, only we, the people do. Unless we change, unless people focus more on hard work, healthy living, and minimizing this malignant materialism, we’re going to keep getting fatter, dumber, and deeper in debt. Until we change, this downward spiral is going to keep spinning. Wake up. Simplify.

  8. #108

  9. #109
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
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    Wake up. Simplify
    I like this! I am so into the tiny house movement, I drive my wife crazy dreaming of selling everything, building a tiny house, raising my chickens and just being free from all the stuff. I would rather be poor and free than live like a rich man and be a slave to debt. Life is soo short, the older you get the faster life moves and before you know it you are gone. Forget about collecting things and collect experiences(not that I quite live up to that ideal ). That said I still respect anyone who wants to go out make a million dollars and build a mansion. If that's what makes you happy go for it, it's just not for me.
    Last edited by Zippy; Jan 12, 2013 at 03:44 AM.

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by zrich View Post
    I'm not disputing that illegals are an issue and that our immigration policy needs to be fixed. I am disputing what you tout as stats from a PBS show. How big of a problem is this really? I don't know, but there are millions of cases of people losing jobs every year in this country. Some are due to illegals, some are due to technological advancements, some are new products, some due to relocation of manufacturing, some due to other factors. Should we make technological advancement illegal because it costs people jobs and puts them on welfare?

    How much do you think it will cost to deport every illegal? We spent $18B last year to remove some 400K illegals - that works out to $45K/illegal deported. Estimates seem to range from 7-20M illegals. Extrapolate that $45K and you're looking at $315-900B. Personally, I just don't think that's economically feasible in the current economy. I don't agree with providing services people who exploit the system, but there are plenty of US citizens that fall into that category as well as illegal immigrants.
    The funny thing about your statement is that you are comparing citizens with illegals when it comes to abusing the system. No one should abuse the system but illegals abusing it is far worse. They break the law every day they are here and broke the law when they came here. The word "illegal" is the giveaway. Why should I follow laws because our country is telling me they don't do anything about other people breaking it. Some of these illegals are also major criminals (rapist, drug cartel, etc.). We don't know anything about these people. National Security alone should tell us to deport them.