Discussing Roy's surfboard designs.

[LBCrew]

In reality the amount of board which is out of the water at any given time depends upon, amongst other factors the speed of the board and the wave shape. You seem to be suggesting that performance is hindered when the board is able to increase or decrease the wetted surface area in response to rider demands and wave conditions, when clearly that isn't the case.

I noticed a bit of a lag between the shape of the wave and the board's response... the exceptionally long lever forcing the entry rocker down (increasing wetted surface) in spite of the reduced tail area and round rails. My guess is it's due to the extreme weight, and perhaps reduced tail area and accelerated tail rocker? Can increased tail volume make up some of that lag? Your increased entry rocker responds well, however, getting the board back up on plane. It looks to me that at this point, flex is critical.

Roy?

[yankee]

I noticed a bit of a lag ... the exceptionally long lever .... the extreme weight....increased tail volume ....increased entry rocker ... getting the board back up ... flex is critical. Roy?

Sounds more like "increased tail volume" makes for a harsh & painful "entry rocker" scene in a prison movie, not a surfboard design.

(Took some editing liberties, LBCrew, hey, it's not serious it's the Internet.)

Anyways, Stuart's shell game is predicated on the old, but ever-more-popular scammer mentality of the shysters in our culture today, when they say hey, I don't have to prove that all of my amazing claims are right.....you have to prove that I'm wrong!

Stuart is total BS. There were snake oil salesmen back in the day; this year, it's deer antler spray pitchmen; same mentality as the guy pitching huge-money heavy, sluggish wooden surfboards with that big whoopty 'flex' for 'performance.' Same type scam, just a different vehicle to part one's money from one's wallet.

[Roy Stuart]

I noticed a bit of a lag between the shape of the wave and the board's response... the exceptionally long lever forcing the entry rocker down (increasing wetted surface) in spite of the reduced tail area and round rails. My guess is it's due to the extreme weight, and perhaps reduced tail area and accelerated tail rocker? Can increased tail volume make up some of that lag? Your increased entry rocker responds well, however, getting the board back up on plane. It looks to me that at this point, flex is critical.

Roy?

I appreciate your taking the time to check it out and ask about what you are seeing.

Firstly, a correction regarding the rocker on the Makaha 12-9. It is exceptionally low throughout the entire 9 feet of tail, from memory the rocker over the whole long tail is around 1 inch.

Also, the board planes at all times at surfing speeds, although as all planing craft do it displaces some water and thus gets some lift from displacement.

Regarding weight she's a lightweight at 24 pounds, and is very responsive.

I'm trying to understand what you are asking about. Are you referring to the occasions when the nose rocker comes into contact with the wave? There's one moment in the video where I stall and when the pocket catches up with me and as the tail lifts the nose rocker enters the water. The board then accelerates out of the pocket. The high lift produced by the nose comes with a drag penalty, but due to the high lift it is only momentary as the lift brings the nose up. For the vast majority of the time at surfing speeds the highly rockered nose area is out of the water, it's used for a quick lift onto the plane when taking off from low speed and for lifting the nose out of situations where needed. The advantage over even rocker ( which I use on other designs) is that as speed increases only the flatter faster part of the rocker is used.

The acceleration in response to the wave is very prompt.

Flex is a nice bonus but isn't strictly necessary on this shape in terms of nose lift. She's a very flexible board in a land test but as is always the case the feeling in the water from the 'twang' is subtle ( though powerful). There are two high pressure area on the board. One is of course at the leading edge of the wetted surface area, and the other is at the tail, due to lift from the tunnel fin. This is a secret to effective use of flex, it enables the board to load up in between the two high pressure areas.

[Roy Stuart]

Anyways, Stuart's shell game is predicated on the old, but ever-more-popular scammer mentality of the shysters in our culture today, when they say hey, I don't have to prove that all of my amazing claims are right.....you have to prove that I'm wrong!

None of what I say consititutes an 'amazing claim' if one understands what I'm actually saying instead of flying off the handle with only limited comprehension... and I prove what I'm saying in theory and in practice on a daily basis.

I'm interested to know though, if you can tell me what one of these so called 'claims' are.

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[yankee]

None of what I say consititutes an 'amazing claim' if one understands what I'm actually saying instead of flying off the handle with only limited comprehension... and I prove what I'm saying in theory and in practice on a daily basis.

I'm interested to know though, if you can tell me what one of these so called 'claims' are.

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....and Bingo was his name...

....there you go again...

...In essence, anything King Roy says, he of the pretend crown torn from the cookie box, is truthful because King Roy doth say it so, and thus because he spake it, it be truth, ergo, he is right until you prove him wrong....so sayeth King Roy, legend in his own mind.

Or, put another way, or ways:
-- Twist a fiction long enough & wrong enough & loud enough and it starts to sound like 'facts.' (e.g., your pop science claims of "secret spots on the board surface" and other nuances of board construction that only you have mastered)
-- Accuse your critics of not understanding your higher powers & your higher abilities.
(e.g., your rips of people who have surfed your boards & been unilaterally unimpressed with their 'performance')
-- The old parlor trick of braying that your aspects are correct simply because no one has 'proved' them wrong

You, convenient to your case, ignore human common sense & obvious fact / evidence, in your case, video & first-hand product user statements in re: the sub-par performance and fallibility of your products.

[Roy Stuart]

...In essence, anything King Roy says, he of the pretend crown torn from the cookie box, is truthful because King Roy doth say it so, and thus because he spake it, it be truth, ergo, he is right until you prove him wrong....so sayeth King Roy, legend in his own mind.

I've never said anything of the sort.

You can't proceed by making up statements on my behalf.

claims of "secret spots on the board surface" and other nuances of board construction that only you have mastered)

No such claims have been made.

-- Accuse your critics of not understanding your higher powers & your higher abilities.

I've never said that either, I've simply pointed out that when they do what you are doing ( i.e. make stuff up which I've supposedly said) that they have obviously not read and understood what has been written i.e. it is a reading comprehension issue on their part.

(e.g., your rips of people who have surfed your boards & been unilaterally unimpressed with their 'performance')

I'm entitled to point out that if the rider stands way back on the displacement tail and thus fails to ride the board as designed that it is rider error... and this hardly constitutes an outrageous claim.

-- The old parlor trick of braying that your aspects are correct simply because no one has 'proved' them wrong

One can hardly 'bray' using the written word, and again I've never said anything of the kind.

When I am correct it is for reasons to do with physics, logic, experience and reporting of past events, it is ludicrous to suggest that something can be correct because of something which hasn't been done by someone else... at least make your Roy parody slightly believable, please, since direct quotes are beyond you.

You, convenient to your case, ignore human common sense & obvious fact / evidence, in your case, video & first-hand product user statements in re: the sub-par performance and fallibility of your products.

Would you like me to start posting the long list of positive reviews on the board which is now in San Francisco?

As for video, the footage on this very thread is prime evidence of unusually fine longboard performance.

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[bubonicphoniks]

You never answered my questions. Your boards are priced so high to get people talking about them, like us. I get it. I am for making surfing more affordable. Things already cost alot.

[Roy Stuart]

You didn't answer my questions. Your boards are priced so highly in order to get people talking about them, like us. I get it. I am for making surfing more affordable. Things already cost a lot.

I fixed your grammar, don't worry there's no charge the first time.

Please remind me what your questions were.

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[brewengineer]

I fixed your grammar, don't worry there's no charge the first time.

Please remind me what your questions were.

.

You have no real business or tact training, do you?

Don't worry, you do not need to answer that. There are long threads on 6 different forums that cover that question.

[Erock]

We must be so dense.

35 pages and we still haven't figured out that the MOST efficient and progressive way to surf is to look like a motionless slug with feet on each rail, riding a glorified windsurfer from the early '80s.

BTW, does anyone else see the irony in Roy telling everyone we have the idea surfing all wrong... yet he champions his board being ridden by someone sponsored by Wavejet?