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  1. #81
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    And what are the odds of it even going extinct? I could see if they totally relaxed all restrictions and let people run wild completely tearing the place up. even then I doubt it would go extinct.

  2. #82
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    It would probly just move it's nesting ground to a place more protected. Like Pea Island I think they mentioned in the video is a huge bird sanctuary?

    What really gets me is they are physically stopping/killing/trapping this birds natural predators from getting it. Total Contradiction!

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by aka pumpmaster View Post
    And what are the odds of it even going extinct? I could see if they totally relaxed all restrictions and let people run wild completely tearing the place up. even then I doubt it would go extinct.
    i doubt they are even good eating. Probably all gristle. F em.

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by wallysurfr View Post
    It would probly just move it's nesting ground to a place more protected. Like Pea Island I think they mentioned in the video is a huge bird sanctuary?

    What really gets me is they are physically stopping/killing/trapping this birds natural predators from getting it. Total Contradiction!

    Contradiction and hypocrisy are the ways of the enviro-nazi.

  5. #85
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    Nov 2009
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    in the grace of the most holy FSM
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    Quote Originally Posted by andrewk529 View Post
    I would argue that there are many areas on the Outer Banks, which have lower beach densities, and are easily accessible for handicap individuals, with abundant wildlife. Again, I am in favor of closing the beaches in specific areas when breeding species are present. It would be arrogant to assert humanity over wildlife, especially when species viability is at stake. Last time I checked Humans were not in danger of extinction.
    i'm going to ignore the fact that you're basically saying that people w/ handicaps don't have the right to access the same stretches of beach that non-handicaps do (b/c they can't walk as far).
    closing areas where nesting/breeding birds are would be fine & prob. wouldn't get an argument from most folks if 2 things happened: 1) you could pass thru or by those closed areas to get to the open areas on the other side of the enclosure (this is why the cape point area is currently closed). this option is presently prohibited under the current "agreement." & 2) the draconian procedures for dealing w/ a violation of the enclosures were softened. the enclosures are massive, but might contain only a small number of nests, b/c the size/space requirements are insane to begin w/ & then a few bad apples get drunk & vandalize it.

    as i've said before, there needs to be a RATIONAL compromise...the viability of the piping plover is not at stake w/ these closures. it, & it's endangered brethren, nest on a thousand different islands up & down the east coast in the summer months before heading back to south america.




    Quote Originally Posted by andrewk529 View Post
    realisitically this isn't a plausible scenario.
    i'm glad you realize this fact...ORV access & use is a part of hatteras island culture & that culture should not be forced into extinction b/c of the irrational demands of a small group of people who have no historical/cultural knowledge (nor do they desire any) of the area in question. to say that the locals don't understand the situation or desire the birds to become extinct (as some have) is to insult the intelligence of & degrade the people who populate the banks.

  6. #86
    Compromise, braddas. dump a bunch of money on local plover/endangered species protection, further education on the potential detriment to the ecosystem, ORV Permits and tighter off-road restrictions.. but still with the access that makes the beaches such a prime destination. Raise local tax to fund protection/restoration, since the local revenue will increase with greater tourist population.

    It seems heinous to me to destroy (i don't care if you think it won't, you're ignorant if you do) the economy and lifestyle an already struggling community of human beings by enacting a near pointless and conspiracy-based piece of legislation that has been PROVEN to have little to no positive effect. However, i also find it preposterous to let a few ignorant ORV users cause serious detriment to such a beautiful ecosystem, ruining such a wonderful part of the East Coast for the tens of thousands that look forward to the next time they get to travel there.

    I wouldn't expect people that didn't understand what ORV access means to the locals of the Outer Banks and to the people that go there, and thus the economy and way of life; to support major, life-changing, decisions about the future of said people. But i see that happening in this forum (not pointing any fingers.) So why don't you let the people who do understand why ORV beach access is a necessary part of life in the OBX find a solution that reflects both the rights of the human, and the rights of the plover?? Thank you.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by njsurfer42 View Post
    i'm going to ignore the fact that you're basically saying that people w/ handicaps don't have the right to access the same stretches of beach that non-handicaps do (b/c they can't walk as far).
    closing areas where nesting/breeding birds are would be fine & prob. wouldn't get an argument from most folks if 2 things happened: 1) you could pass thru or by those closed areas to get to the open areas on the other side of the enclosure (this is why the cape point area is currently closed). this option is presently prohibited under the current "agreement." & 2) the draconian procedures for dealing w/ a violation of the enclosures were softened. the enclosures are massive, but might contain only a small number of nests, b/c the size/space requirements are insane to begin w/ & then a few bad apples get drunk & vandalize it.

    as i've said before, there needs to be a RATIONAL compromise...the viability of the piping plover is not at stake w/ these closures. it, & it's endangered brethren, nest on a thousand different islands up & down the east coast in the summer months before heading back to south america.






    i'm glad you realize this fact...ORV access & use is a part of hatteras island culture & that culture should not be forced into extinction b/c of the irrational demands of a small group of people who have no historical/cultural knowledge (nor do they desire any) of the area in question. to say that the locals don't understand the situation or desire the birds to become extinct (as some have) is to insult the intelligence of & degrade the people who populate the banks.
    they need to do what we do here on lbi. we fence off the area on the beach closer up to the dune, depending on where the clovers currently are. there are people monitoring where each nest is, and how long it will be there, so its not the entire island at one time. and even on the beaches with the fencing there's still plenty of room for people to chill on (you already cant drive on the beach)

  8. #88
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    Oct 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by andrewk529 View Post
    There are miles of beaches which are easily accessible, where breeding bird species haven't formed breeding colonies; I am sorry to hear about the impairments, but these beaches that you obviously enjoy are being degraded by automobile traffic. If you think you can appreciate with an engine running, turn it off sometime, you'll be pleasantly surprised.
    Unstated assumptions.

    Okay, Einstein, could you please tell the rest of us what lead you decide that everyone here is some sort of Captain Planet enemy? By climbing up on your little podium and talking down to everyone, you have already (1) insulted everyone here and (2) killed any chance of your audience taking you seriously. Try exercising a little tact, and maybe people will in turn respect the brain power that you so humbly claim to possess. I am not necessarily opposed to your side of the argument, but I would NEVER side with you because you have convinced me that you do not understand how to discuss anything. Throwing $5 words around like some arrogant Harvard grad does not make you intelligent.

  9. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by sjserpe View Post
    Compromise, braddas. dump a bunch of money on local plover/endangered species protection, further education on the potential detriment to the ecosystem, ORV Permits and tighter off-road restrictions.. but still with the access that makes the beaches such a prime destination. Raise local tax to fund protection/restoration, since the local revenue will increase with greater tourist population.

    It seems heinous to me to destroy (i don't care if you think it won't, you're ignorant if you do) the economy and lifestyle an already struggling community of human beings by enacting a near pointless and conspiracy-based piece of legislation that has been PROVEN to have little to no positive effect. However, i also find it preposterous to let a few ignorant ORV users cause serious detriment to such a beautiful ecosystem, ruining such a wonderful part of the East Coast for the tens of thousands that look forward to the next time they get to travel there.

    I wouldn't expect people that didn't understand what ORV access means to the locals of the Outer Banks and to the people that go there, and thus the economy and way of life; to support major, life-changing, decisions about the future of said people. But i see that happening in this forum (not pointing any fingers.) So why don't you let the people who do understand why ORV beach access is a necessary part of life in the OBX find a solution that reflects both the rights of the human, and the rights of the plover?? Thank you.
    Wow! Just WOW! Common sense.

  10. #90
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
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    Cape May Co, NJ
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    Quote Originally Posted by MATT JOHNSON View Post
    yes i can appreciate the sound of a engine . Build one from a Bare Block to a full out 12.5 to 1 compression ration ran on race fuel. No need for a radio at all!!. And the smell of leaded VP C12 race fuel Makes me think of Victory!
    Love the smell of race gas - only one things better - thats NITRO - but it does feel like you got maced if get a little too much. The big boys are comming to E-town next month if you need a nitro fix. Also the modifiers are at Atco Sunday with the nostaglia races but I think the surf will be too good to go.