Kissed by God

May be true for some but most people who deal with mental illness actually hate that they have to say they have a mental illness. You get labeled. You are looked at differently. It’s not something we are proud of. But we learn to manage our lives the best we can. It has not held me back, I am prospering plenty. Living my dreams! I am happy despite my constant fight against my brain.

 

Amazing!! I got scammed on the ticket I bought through CL. Denied at the door, but sweet talked the 91x promo team and scored a free ticket! The dude that sold me the fake refunded my money too.

 

Well stated argument by "northendcanyon". One of the fathers of "psychology" once stated he did not believe it could ever qualify as a true scientific field (no longer recall his name). Europe began institutionalizing people considered to have mental disorders back in the 14th century, all asylums known for dehumanizing conditions. Of course, those people then exhibited extreme behavior, in reaction to their environment.

As for "bi-polar', surely hordes of people are wrongly given the label and then abused, just like people were with the label "schizophrenia" beginning back in the early 1900's. New labels are continually coined to this very day. I can easily recall when it was considered evil to go see a "psychologist/psychiatrist". In the end, it all seems to be nothing but quackery to me, with lots of high dollar snake oil to go with it.

I don't support speaking ill of the dead. They are incapable of adding insight and refuting wrongs said about them. My take on the production of the film is just that. Additionally, people (investors, producers, directors, actors...) are all simply looking for nothing more than to earn big bucks off of him in the process. It's for those reasons that none of them will receive mine.

 

That's actually pretty funny. I can't say for sure it was for lord huron, but it might of been. In NYC they have this "central park summer stage". Basically a outdoor concert every week. Some pretty good bands play. Usually go to a few shows every summer there. That's the venue i was at the first time i saw huron. Pretty sure he opened for alt-j. Anyway, got tickets off stub hub, was told my ticket was already scanned in to the show. I just looked at the dude scanning the tickets... you know, the look like your saying I'm coming in anyway. He just shrugged and was like ehhh i don't care.

Glad you enjoyed the show man!

 

You and northern canyon are both wrong, sorry to say.
First of all, "psychology" (you both refer to it) has ZERO ROLE in the diagnosis and treatment of organic brain disease (schizophrenia, BP, Catatonia, depression, etc) Both of you are talking about behavioral treatments of minor inconsequential depression due to a bad hair day with psychology.
It is PSYCHIATRY that treats those MEDICAL diseases (not always correctly). The difference to you neophytes is that psychiatry is a medical profession, psychology is nothing of the sort. Psychiatry has good objective science in recent times, psychology still depends on rats ringing bells for food. Psychology is behavioral, not medical--HUGE DIFFERENCE.
BP, Schizophrenia, catatonia, endogenous depression are MEDICAL diseases, disorders in the function of brain chemistry. Psychology has no role there; it is the domain of medically trained physicians, i.e., psychiatrists.
Now having said that in response to both of your confusions or lack of knowledge in this department, as I stated in my original post on this thread, we have a long way to go. Medicine advanced dramatically in the last 6 to7 decades (since penicillin and steroids inventions), but psychiatry remained behind, simply because of stigma, and lack of funds. This has changed in the last 20-30 years (somewhat) and psychiatry has recently made advances.
Lastly, if I am correct, Andy had Bi-Polar disease, not a case of simple exogenous depression. BP is an organic brain disease; it requires a medical professional, not a psychologist.
Both of your ideas are what contribute to the holding back in advances in psychiatry. It is akin to the way politicians think, and unfortunately, it is those morons that hold the strings, often times, to the purses for mental research.
Having said that, you both contribute to the discussion by elucidating exactly how we should NOT think about mental illness.
I know neither one of you is a bad guy, but I am sorry to say, you are both severely misinformed. Update your knowledge by reading on the topic--you both will be glad you did.
Have a good day, gentlemen.

 

Spew, Barry, speeeeeeeewww...

 

Dr. Barry

 

Barry was nothing but a lowly pill peddler...they are a dime a dozen in the pharmaceutical industry.

 

My problem is that there is a lack of mathematical foundation for these psychiatric diagnoses, which means it does not compute for me.

I'm not saying mental illness doesn't exist as it is stated, my position, and I am firm here and will not change my mind until science (math) catches up to the diagnoses, is that mental illness as it is proposed is actually very normal human expression caused more so by an inadequate life situation than by a physical defect of the brain or genome.

DawnPatrolSUP, you cannot take this as "he's saying my life is shitty, IT'S NOT!". I'm saying that our modern ideals of human existence are far removed from the true existence we evolved to live on this planet.

Anyways, I will yield. As I stated previously, in my opinion, this topic is highly debatable, and I am not much for debating. I like being 100% mathematically correct

 

I think it's also worth noting, before I ditch you guys for another year, that many abnormal brain conditions, such as psychopathy, are considered to be evolutionarily advantageous.

Human populations are diverse, and that includes brain function. If you do not fit the status quo you are not automatically mentally ill.

It's possible that DawnPatrolSUP and his progeny are actually just further evolved, and the rest of us retards that are happy all the time are the ones with the broken brain.

Disclaimer: I suffered from severe depression since I was a young child even, predomicnantly because of childhood obesity (before the epidemic, I'm 31) and the cascading effects thereof, including being treated like and feeling like less than a human. I haven't been obese since I was 17, but the depression still lingers like a little punk ass black cloud. It's made me a better person, as adversity tends to do, but I spent a lot of time feeling mentally ill and sorry for myself and that didn't fix anything. What did fix it was me strapping myself up by the bootstraps and taking control of my brain (Eastern style).

 

If you have not seen"the math" then you are reading the wrong publications. In recent times, the organic brain diseases have received ample mathematical support within the research data. One need only to look at Journal of Psychiatry to view a few. They have strong support with statistical modeling. Also, as so many others, you are misusing "evolution" to support an untenable position.
I am glad you pulled out of your youthful physical dilemma of obesity. Mine was, and still is, severe disabling migraines. Other than originating in the brainstem (recent neurological research proves this), it is not "mental disease", thank god--I will take the migraines over schizophrenia or BP any day.
Talk to you then, in a year?? Buh bye.

 

Disabling migraines...that might explain the habitual speeeeewing.

Citations? Nevermind. Plenty of other research will offer other possible scenarios. Good thing you aren't hooked on the Fiorcet/Fiorinal, due to all. Those rebound headaches from taking them only compound the problem, forcing you to feel the need to take even more.

Regardless Barry, as previously stated, northendcanyon is well written and continues to make his case extremely well.

 

Since we are being cordial, I'll play along for a bit

To be fair, I haven't read any journals related to psychiatry, EVER I disagree that my usage of evolution is incorrect, perhaps your definition is too rigid. Do machines evolve in your opinion? They absolutely do, there is technological evolution happening all around us. Good ideas survive, bad ones die. Shitty brain patterns will die off, useful ones (even if detrimental to the perceived well-being of the person with the defected brain pattern) will survive. Psychopathy has passed the culling of evolution, for now. So has bi polar disorder and depression.

I did search earlier for mathematical models characterizing bi polar disorder, to be sure I wasn't completely off base, and there are articles that appear. If you have a specific example that isn't trouble to dig up, I would be happy to take a look. I realize that is not your responsibility.

My field of expertise is not psychology or psychiatry, so, anyone that feels genuinely discomforted by their brain function should probably seek the help of a professional and not take the advice of a jabroni (me) on your local surf forum.

 

You make some good points...especially differentiating psychology vs psychiatry. Though, I don't think they (medical research) have determined the biological change the brain goes through for bipolar disorder. As for cause, I think canyon is hitting on the environmental influences of developing the disorder...trauma for instance.
I would be curious to see a study regarding the biology of this disorder. I grew up with a close friend who committed suicide in his 30s. He seemed normal (well,I guess that is relative) growing up. Diagnosed late 20s. Not sure we could ever determine what triggered it. Strange disorder!

Still much to be discovered in da cranium!

 

@northendcanyon, I share many of your opinions on the human brain and the practices of psychology/psychiatry. However, I'm having a difficult time with your theory on equating mental health through mathematics.

How, exactly, does one apply mathematical equation to brain activity?

Is such an approach even by researched by leading specialists? And if so, wouldn't it be logical to assume that those same theories could be applied to the medical (surgical) aspect involving the brain and its functions?

Personally having a hard time applying math to psychological functions, but it doesn't mean it's not possible.

And if you don't mind, what is your professional background? You appear reasonably well versed in the subject matter.

 

I like boobies

 

1+1=boobs

Freud math

 

The problem with "environmental forces" in BP is that the evidence is against it. It is genetic. Nothing has been shown to precipitate it from the environment. What the data does show is that BP emerges in humans in the late teens to early twenties, rarely after that. Same with schizophrenia. That points to genetic malfeasance; something went wrong. Also, in BP for sure (cannot recall about schizophrenia data), the disease runs in families--strong evidence for that. One of my friends had BP, his older brother, and his sister also. Only one sibling, another girl, did not inherit the disease. One of their parents was a carrier of the gene, transmitting it to the kids. Sad.
Suicide. A majority of BP patients eventual do try to kill themselves. The disease is compromised of 2 periods, Depression and mania. When a patient "rapid cycles" between the two, they are depressed, but retain the energy from the mania section sufficiently to attempt to kill themselves. That is in any book on psychiatry or the disease.

 

LOL...

LP, relevant to the topic, northendcanyon possesses and undergraduate degree in biology.

 

There is much to be said for the old adage, "History repeats itself", mathematical models support it. All you have to do is look to warfare, in way of example. Mankind has a tendency to forget what it has already learned over the course of time. You may wish to think upon it as universal "Alzheimer's Disease". In other words, we humans are basically "morons", as Barry frequently sums it up for all. It takes old dogs, such as the likes of us, to remind young dogs of the past, less it be forgotten. Some label it as "wisdom".