Requesting help with my SUP build

Its customary to introduce yourself.
Take pretty much everything you saw that YouTuber you mentioned do on YouTube and throw it out the window.
Your post is so long I stopped reading at Andrew.
Hate Sweepers. Unmotivated.
Start over with an introduction and brief requests related to an actual surfboard. Cheers.

 

I've only used US Composites for 2-part foam and fillers like Q-cel. Their epoxy is inexpensive but not UV stable. It will work but you'd have to paint the finished product.

 

Use EPS, not PU, which will result in a very heavy board. Use the lightest EPS you can find. I recommend buying a 1lb EPS SUP blank, not the stuff from Home Depot. But if you do go that route, be sure you're buying EPS (expanded) not XPS (extruded).

Use surfbord-specific resin, not West Systems or other. Resin Research produces very high quality surfboard-specific resin. Greenlight's guide is pretty accurate for amounts. Add 10-15% more if you're a novice glasser, and avoid fast cure hardener. Seal your shaped blank very well before glassing.

 

Hey Shark, to start I would only use epoxy and other materials that are surfboard specific because of UV stability and tons of other reasons. Use the stuff made for surfboards - full stop.

For your first board, buy more than you need. Leftovers are great for ding repair, and the worst possible thing that could happen is to start a lamination or something and not have enough resin.

Buy a surfboard blank. You will save so many headaches. Once you have a board or two under your belt you can experiment and try to save money, but for board #1, your only goal should be to finish it. Board #2 and #3 will be less expensive too once you have all your tools paid for.

On your first board, do not make things more difficult by cutting corners or trying to save money. Shaping a surfboard, especially just one, is going to be expensive, hard, dirty work, and will test your patience. You need to focus on one goal: Finish it. It's not going to be pretty, or perfect, but if you do all the prep work correctly, hopefully it won't fall apart on you. Then you can make another one and learn from your mistakes. That is simply the only way to do this unless you have a in-person mentor guiding you step by step.

My main point: If your goal is to have a SUP without spending $1000, your doing this for the wrong reason. The only reason to build a surfboard is because you want to build a surfboard. If you're trying to save money, buy a pop-out, enjoy it, and move on down the road.

 

I buy Resin Research epoxy (best surfboard resin I have found), fiberglass cloth, fin boxes, from these guys:

http://www.fiberglasssupply.com

Their prices are good, I've never had an order messed up, and they are usually able to answer my tech questions. I agree with not getting the fast cure, for a big project, especially if you haven't a lot of experience in glassing. It lets you take your time, reduces stress.

You mentioned you are in Canada? Be forewarned....glassing in cool or cold temperatures can result in unexpectedly long times for the resin to harden as you finish up glassing.

 

I've mostly used Resin Research epoxy resin and Fiberglass Supply for polyester.

Most likely beginner-newbie mistakes:

1) Deluded into thinking that an epoxy over eps will be lighter than polyester over polyurethane or epoxy over polyurethane: This is true only if you don't use too thick a wet-out with the epoxy resin which is thicker and more glue-like. It's not as drippy so be careful if you use it. Otherwise, you will wind up with a board that actually weighs more. It's a lighter final product ONLY if you use it sparingly. It is very strong though, and it CAN be used over cedar stringers or boards which have a lot of natural oil-bleed.

2) It's vapors are less volatile than polyester but it's MORE trouble if you spill it or get it on your skin.

As for the details - ie. mixing the stuff - I normally use a scale but it can be done by volume also. Look up the details. I've been away from building for a while until I clean up my basement and garage. You can go on swaylocks. I have a board or two pictured there. I'm like you - I haven't done many boards yet.

Good luck - the hardest part is the shaping of the foam. I use computer software and a CNC machine to rough out my blanks. I have a vacuum installed if I really need to mow foam with a planer.

I would recommend that you simply borrow the resin and fiberglass from scraps your buddies have. Just cobble together stuff for your first board.

Good idea to use building insulation though - glue up some insulation to get the thickness, then saw it down the middle, and glue in the stringer of your choice.

One last comment on my above warning about the weight of an epoxy board for you and for LBCrew who has a certain skepticism:

1. Depending on the density of the foam and the thickness of the pour (whether or not you've thinned with 10% thinner such as thinner or acetone), depending on the glass weave, depending on the blank - ie. eps, poly, poly-blue, etc.., and depending on whether or not you seal the board, the resulting boards you make WILL differ in weight. Some board-makers have a better touch at the amount to pour over the glass. It's NOT uncommon for a beginner to end up with an epoxy board that's heavier - here's a link to a swaylock's thread that discusses this a little bit. If you really use eps foam, you are off to a good enough start, that the final board SHOULD be lighter:

https://www.swaylocks.com/forum/59994/epoxy-surfboard-weight
https://www.swaylocks.com/forum/60443/spreadsheet-resin-usage-epoxy-and-polyester

Takeaways:
1) See if you can get away with 1/2 the resin a beginner might accidentally use
2) Possibly seal the board with Cerex
3) Squeegee the glass tightly to the foam, but not too tightly as that is ALSO a common mistake (then brush) - don't float the glass up too much.
4) Sand the coats well particularly if you've gone a little thick.

My first epoxy home-made board took a lot of sanding due to too much resin as you may be able to discern from the above side-view.

 

I always warm my epoxy resin before glassing and get a nice runny consistency. Honestly, I use almost exactly the same amount of resin research fast cure epoxy resin to wet out and laminate a board as I would poly resin for the same board/glass schedule. Same with the hot coat. So even if I'm using the same glassing schedule the EPS core produces a lighter finished board. BUT given the inherent strength of EPS/epoxy construction I can often cut back a bit on the glass and save even more weight.

I'm not super concerned with absolute lightness like some surfers are about their boards, but man I gotta disagree here about the basic weight advantage of EPS/epoxy vs. PU/PE. its real, and i'm a novice glasser.

 

I'm pretty conservative with poly, too... but I do still use more poly than epoxy. I don't do the full resin curtain, but something close... just try to control the flow as much as possible and catch what I can back in the bucket. Resin swirls are the worst. MOST of the resin hits the floor... a small sacrifice for a beautiful, even marble look.

 

To SharkLaser, LB Crew, and Mitchell, I totally agree that a lightweight starting foam, and good touch with the squeegee and resin is a lighter finished surfboard.

I just wanted SharkLaser to hear what happens if someone is wanton on their first board. Mitchell and LBCrew are spot on to share with me their edified experiences.

By the way, SharkLaser may need to study how to achieve rocker if he goes the route of true building insulation so I urge him to read up on that.

At least I'm starting to clean up my basement as he's motivating and inspiring me - it's contagious.

 

Just to be clear, I mean't I think I use pretty much the same amount of resin in the actual lamination regardless of poly vs. epoxy. For a clear lam, If i'm kicking off poly, I do mix up a couple ounces more resin in the batch if its poly so I can work faster, but that extra couple ounces isn't staying in the cloth, its mostly on the floor or back in the cup at the end.

 

Reading all the wisdom from these guys makes me want to get dusty again, too.

If I was to start a new board I would need to re-up on sandpaper (not cheap for the good stuff, unless I buy in bulk which I don't need), blank, cloth, resin, fin boxes, leash plug, paint brushes, mixing cups, gloves, stuff for cleanup. I have some painters tape, razor blades, and some squeegees from ding repair.

Then add in the time. What's my time worth these days? A lot more than when I was building boards a few years ago. This, in my opinion, is the real cost. That's why I say that the only reason to build a board is because you really want to!

So, for just a little more money, and a lot less time, I can have someone who has shaped hundreds of boards build it for me, and I know it will work. For this reason I think that not building a board should always be a part of the board building equation.

 

It's like making ice cream. Yeah, it's delicious. Yeah, it's fun. But when you add up the cost of all the ingredients and the time it takes to make it, you could have bought 3 times as much ice cream at the store. True story.

 

I've got about 50 boards under my belt. The first 5 were perhaps not worth the effort although a couple of them worked really good despite being ugly. I learned a lot on those early boards though......no internet or YouTube back then. These days I'm making a hp shortboard for about $230 plus my time. I figure its about 10 to 12 hours of labor. I buy my cloth by the roll to get the cost down there and stockpiled FCS Fusion and FCSII fin boxes a few years back. I just buy blanks and resin as needed.

 

Yeahbut...how much does it cost you to make a gallon of ice cream?

 

VHS tapes of John Carper Shaping 101 and Glassing 101. Yew! He made it look so. damn. easy. Probably because the tapes skipped over so many of the nasty little devils in the detail. And because he had done it 10,000 times already.

 

I started even before those tapes came out. Made my first board in 1989 in my parent's driveway. Those tapes didn't come along until 1996. The only resource I had when I started was an outdated softcover book about building surfboards that I ordered from an ad in the back of Surfing Magazine.



Here is board #1 from 1989. Ugly as hell. Board actually worked good. Still have it.



Here is another early one. First longboard I ever made. 1994. Still have this one too. This one gave me fits glassing. It was hot out and I'd never glassed a longboard. Resin was going off before I finished tucking the laps. Learned by trial and error.

 

Here's how trial and error it was when I started out. On my first board, not knowing what gloss resin was I bought a can of un-pigmented waxed gellcoat. Shit was really expensive too. It came out of the can like jelly. I squeegied that over the board for my final finish coat of resin. What a bitch that was to sand. LOL!!! Live and learn.