Steve O breaks down how to go about purchasing your next or first Surfboard. This thread is a Discussion in response to the following Swellinfo news Article http://www.swellinfo.com/surfnews/buying-a-surfboard.html This article was submitted to the Swellinfo Surf News section on April 9, 2009
"Eventually, this may lead you to calling a shaper and having them shape boards specifically for you. You can do this at the start, but it's usually not worth the time, hassle and expense unless you know exactly what works for you (about 2% of us)." Has this guy ever worked with a shaper before??? The whole point of working with a shaper to get a custom is that the shaper knows board design better than any shop rat and your shaper can dial in a design to fit your specific need. Really disappointed in this article and it's neglect of promoting the custom board order. Walking into a shop to buy a board can work IF you know what works for you, but I would never trust a 15 year old shop rat, or some crusty and cranky old surf shop owner to tell me how a shapers board will work for me. Go right to the source and work with the shaper.
if you can work 1 on 1 with a shaper than it can be beneficial... But, every slight little dimension change has an effect on your riding, so if you dont know what works for you, designing a custom shape can be really challenging. I think the point he was trying to make, was find out what works best for you first by experimentation, before you go tweaking dimensions with your own custom designs.
shapers rock! RDJ...sorry you didn't like the article! To be honest the article was written for the general population. And a devils advocate would indeed say go to a shaper and get it custom (the direct source). But you must know what works for you before you start tweaking small dimensions. The article is just a guide. If you get the "grand scheme of things," everyone is still getting paid. I have surfed a long time and to be honest, if I was to go to a shaper and tell him what I wanted it would still be based of my last board or two. And who mentioned making a purchase from a 15 year old surf rat? If you read the article that disappointed you so badly, I strongly recommend (quote!) ,"I would never purchase a car from someone who does not know what they are talking about!" I am 28 years old and I feel I am just entering my surfing prime. I like the idea of a relationship with a shaper (being one myself) but this is not realistic in the mid-atlantic for everyone. I have work, coaching, working out, work, surfing, and work. I don't have time for a relationship with someone making something for my leisurely purpose. There are some great shapers around, but I will venture out to say that if we put out a poll of who works with shapers routinely, the ratio would not favor "people working with shapers!" If someday I develop a relationship with a great shaper, I will write an article on that topic. But for now, I am going down to K-coast when I need my next board.
Most of the surf shops I walk into have kids working the board room/rack. I don't trust a kid to tell me how a board off the rack will behave in comparison to my last two boards. They don't shape. Most don't understand the elements of design. There are a few shops, however, where most of the time you will be given attention by the owner or someone with enough experience to guide you through an off the rack purchase. Take Ocean Hut for example. Tony used to shape his own label, Creme Surfboards. Beach House, Eric has more years of longboard knowledge than most anyone in the area. But this isn't the case most of the time. And to use your example of buying a car... I have yet to walk into a car dealer and find a salesman who knows more than I do about the car I'm interested in. And all of that information is available on the internet. But I bet the car designer knows more than me. And wouldn't it be nice to talk to him before buying the car. Well surfing is one one of the activities that allows this opportunity. I just think your article is misleading in that it really doesn't address the custom board order as a valuable option. And as busy as you are, it really doesn't take all THAT much time to talk to a shaper and design a custom. Common now seriously? A few phone calls and emails. The benefits of those few extra minutes will be completely worth it. Experimentation to find what you like will be more successful by changing a few elements at a time through a custom than buying a different board. However, your discussion about used boards is dead on. That is an easy and cheap way to experiment. Buy used, figure out what you like. Then go to a shaper and tell them what you've liked about the used boards and let him work with you to tweak design for a new stick that you'll be completely stoked on. I think one of the serious injustices that we as east coasters inflict upon our own surf culture is the neglect of the custom board and local economy. We are obsessed with California and Hawaii surf culture rather than embracing our own. This is why there is a serious lack of east coast shapers. We need to stop buying Lost and CI boards off the rack and patronize the local shapers who knows our waves. Or at least order customs from a non local shaper who can work with you. I've bought boards off the rack, everyone does. And it is great to experiment with off the rack boards, but sticking to just otr boards you will miss out on a very rewarding dimension to your surfing experience (or leisurely activity as you put it). If my first post came off as offensive or harsh I apologize. This is just some constructive criticism recognizing that your Buying a Board article missed the bus on a very significant option for buying a surfboard. I do appreciate the time you put into drafting the article and the attempt by the site to provide some informative reading. For my surf experience, I'll continue working with shapers to get custom handshaped boards designed specifically for me.
I hope not all surf shops near you have only 15 year old kids working the board rooms... I know in my area (Delmarva), all of the core shops have veteran surfers that know there stuff. The 15 year kids are there, but there is always the owner or manager guy that knows what he is talking about.
Yep. And I did offer two specific examples in my post above. There are others. But still, as much as the shop owner knows, the shaper knows more. And another thing, you are limited to what the store has in stock. If they don't have the right dims for you, the salesman/owner may push you towards a board they have in stock with different dims. Or you go in looking for one model and they are out of stock, BUT they have this other model that works just as well... get the idea. They want to make the sale. Everyone is hurting nowadays and you can't blame them. But why risk it. Again, I am NOT saying don't buy off the rack. I like the CI Flyer F quad and I know what dims work for me. If I walk into a shop and they have one in those dims I'd be tempted to buy it. But the article ignored the custom option and to me and many others, that's huge miss in an otherwise well written article. You posted this thread to discuss the article and that's what I'm doing. Pointing out something I think it missed.
2 quotes! from this article..."With all of this said, the more boards you surf the more dimensions you will collect. The more dimensions you collect, the closer you will get to understanding what boards work for you." & ... "A new board is a risk. Find a company or shaper that works for you and stick with them. Find one who shapes boards for your type of waves. Eventually, this may lead you to calling a shaper and having them shape boards specifically for you. You can do this at the start, but it's usually not worth the time, hassle and expense unless you know exactly what works for you (about 2% of us)." I grew up in surfing in NJ, DE, MD and I have never gotten the vibe that the core surfers are obsessed with the surf scene else where. Yes, the kooks are but not the core group itself. The east coast will never be competitive and marketable with in the shaping/surfboard industry. You can not survive on shaping boards in Delaware. Jersey you may have more chance, but the trade off as far as income is not worth it. Surfboards have little mark-up. East has little waves to work with. The 2 just don't make for a great shaping bay. RDJ, I don't think you are being rash. You being protective for your own right. Maybe I should visit John Ashton and do an interview with him. He is a great guy and deserves some recognition. He is the only shaper in my area within a 45 minute drive. An interview would be fine, but a relationship? For that I need a 5 minute drive. A big mistake on my part that I see in this article is I will never EVER recommend having a relationship with a shaper OVER THE PHONE or via email. That to me is stupid. I want to see foam flying, pick up stringers shaved into curly fries, and watch a board being shaped in a cobalt blue room! Thats when you get to have a relationship!
rDJ- If you know an excellent local shaper, just post his name. Very few shapers can produce high performance boards as accuratly as a slightly tweaked CNC model. If you want high performance and dont have time and\or money to waste, go to the rack. If your loookin for a more exotic board like an odd fish, a single fin or a wooden board, it is worth going to a local shaper in order to shake the mainstream. Be cautious, you may end up with an experimental piece of crap.
just throwin it out there, in the delaware/ocmd area Doc of Ocean Atlantic Surf Shop in OCMD is a phenomenal shaper and local legend. Makes great boards, and sells them at fair prices. Rode my first OH on one of his boards. I'd say that's a special connection.
I think a valid point in all this is to say that midatlantic surfers and locals aren't "obsessed" with CA and HI surf culture. With the internet, and youtube and contests and everything else, everyone who surfs on the east coast is exposed to the same "culture" and media that CA and HI are exposed to. And I think east coast surfers are really let down when they hear things like "Those boards wont work here" and we need "specific boards for these local conditions"... As a guy from maryland, there in nothing worse than being in the lineup in CA and have people say sh** like, "there is a beach in maryland"? So, its hard enough to get credibilty as a shaper or pro surfer from the east coast, so I think a lot of guys are sick and tired of hearing that their waves and their home towns are second rate.... I take the same quiver I ride in CA back home to OC MD when i visit. I ride the same boards. If its complete slop, then I just dont go out... But there are good waves to be had back east, and when the good swells come, with the right conditions, I want to be on a the right high performance board. The same technology that guys are using at trestles works great at a pumping 48th street OC MD.. So, im not feeding the local shaper argument one way or another... But go down to OBX and to the places where all the east coast pros are congrigating, and they surely arent riding some strange custom shapes and concepts from local east coast shapers. They are pulling into big barrels at hatteras on the same sticks being used on Oahu. Granted, day to day you can get great ideas and boards from local shapers... But young surfers, developing surfers want to do the same sh** they see on tv. They dont want to cruise on a log. When a good day comes to the mid atlantic, guys want to get boosted. Guys want to get deep in the barrels. Gusy want to blow fins out the back.... No one wants to be told that they can't advance with the same technology the rest of the world is using.... I just think for 95% of surfers, there is already the perfect stick, sitting on a rack somewhere waiting for you... A lot of local shapers get caught up ni re-inventing the wheel, while meanwhile, Al Merrick already produced the local concepts 15 years ago... The firewires, the CI and even the lost brands that you speak of are being developed by the worlds best, and design to be applicable on an international scale... A good CI shortbaord will work well in CA, HI, MD, NJ, AUS and Bali.... you just need the right day.
I pretty much agree here except with not going to a shaper for a first board. I always send first time buyers to a local shaper for several reasons. He will give them a stable board set up for the area they surf. Nine times out of ten they will save money by purchaseing his product over a shops. Last but not least..... You local shaper will make you a more durable board that will last you several years instead of just a summer or two before the deck is completely caved in. The Industry is in it to bleed you out with,most of the time, a poorly manufactered product that they put a pro on in hopes you will buy it for names sake. A local wants your return business as well as your word of mouth business. You get a great board and he in turn gets more customers.
