Duckdive dilemma

I've been through some heavy experiences as well. EC hurricanes, Northern Cals heavy water and CR where my leash snapped on a 14 footer and got stuffed deep underwater. Could consider turn and paddle yr arse off and pick up the wave or take it like a rat. Having other people nearby in the water doesnt help. So sitting in a better place in the first place would help. Of course train to be underwater for a duration, practice zen,

 

Yeah when I watch surf videos for the second time, I pay close attention to the surfers in the background. Who's turning turtle, who's duck diving. When I watch longboard contests it amazes me how those guys duck dive effortlessly (having high performance rails and light foam probably doesn't hurt).

 

At DOH+ pretty much everybody's just diving off their board at that size. That's why it's really important not to be too close behind the guy ahead of you when paddling out.

 

i totally agree- its disturbing when the guy ahead of you keeps paddling right in front knowing that your behind him and that guy would proabably bail when a DOH wave comes... then you gotta deal with the wave AND his board in your face...

SOOOO lets get back to the actual question- cause this is actually a good thread! What do you guys do when 10ft of whitewater is in front of you and you got two guys right behind you- knowing if you bail your board- that it has a fairly good chance at hitting them.

AND- i should add - for the benefit of that NJ Shreader- i believe it is KNOWN that if your out in DOH waves that you are not going to duck dive a bigger board when the wave breaks right in front of you... PLUS- if your out in DOH.... i really hope that you would already know what a duck dive is ... and could hopefully do it as second nature.... duh...

That being said- what do you guys think? I never really like the tutle roll and feel like it hardly ever works correctly.... i think the main point is - what do you do when you know two guys are right behind you??? IF no one is around- of coarse a bail and dive to the bottom holding your leash is expected...

 

To the original poster. This falls in a "grey" area to me, but in my experiences in very heavy winter swells in CA and mexico I.E. Big wednesday, most guys ive been out with are experienced as well in those situations, so simple eye contact and instincts usually keep everyone safe. For instance, I tend to sit a little bit safer in those kind of lineups, since even on huge reefs and points that break almost identically in the same spot, there are always those rouge sets that break 50-60 yards off track.... So, as those rouges are approaching, which you can see from a mile away, everyone starts the scraping and scrambling to get out on the horizon... As this happens, there is usually a natural order and movement like birds. as I paddle out towards the set, I make sure I am aware of my surrounding. I.E. If I see a guy cutting over into my path ahead of me, I begin to take a target line in the opposite direction so as we both paddle further out, we cross paths and continue moving away from each other.... Whenever there are people behind me, I always make sure to look back at them and make some kind of visual contact with them to make sure they see which way I am going, so at the end of the day, when the impact comes or the huge set hits, we usually end up 10-15 feet apart, but almost all lineup next to each other.... This allows everyone to dig as deep as they can, and by this, even with my gun, which is only a 7'2, but I still get as deep as I can... And a true tripple overhead wave at indicators or anywhere in SoCal that can hold it, never break from the top to the flats... when its pushing 20 foot faces, even at a low tide, those spots will break about half way down on the face.... So when you get a barrel on a wave that big in SoCal, you are way up the face, I mean like in the top 1/4 of the face to get inside.... So the point is that on truly huge waves, there is usually a pretty ample slope at the bottom that you can cut your board into and if you go straight down and into it, by the time the impact from the lip comes down, its rolling over and across, not coming right down on you, so if its huge out, cut into the bottom with you gun, push down and hold on for dear life.... I will bear hug it under water so it doesn't catipult into my face or anything like that... I broke a few toes doing this because the final impact was to harsh....

But if you do all of those things, sometimes you may break a toe.... about 50% of the time, you will come up unscathed and the other 50% of the time, you will be 10-15 feet deep and then the turbulance will rip the board right off of you and your body.... When that happens, at least you know that you have positioned yourself far enough away from the pack that you are looking out for others safety.... Sometimes you will be swimming a mile back to shore with no board, avoiding impending doom from the incoming sets, or you can get lucky like my toe breaking situation, come up from about 20 feet deep, following the light with a 12 second hold down or so, to find that your broken leash and board are floating safely about 10 feet away... that is about the best feeling ever....

Craziest thing ive seen someone do in the situation you speak of, was at the above mentioned spot, when the set of the day was coming through... me and one guy made it up and over the peak cause we saw it coming way before everyone else... I saw a woman on a longboard, and this wave face was easily 15-17feet, but the lady just turns towards the beach, in her paddling stance and start paddling towards the beach, meanwhile she is in the flats, right out in front of the impact zone, so the 17 footer detonates and then a 12 foot wall of whitewater just mowed her down like a blade of grass..... You could see that board just flipping and flapping through the whitewater all the way to the beach....

 

In that situation, if I know for sure that the guys behind me, who by the way are being rude and probably out of position... its dangerous to shoulder hop and try and cheat on the inside like that when its big... But if they are for sure behind me, and they arent making much ground and regardless of what I am about to do, I am going to have to take 10 feet of whitewater mowing me down, I will simple sprint paddle horizontally as far as I can in hopes that I can clear their radius in time and then just drop down pencil style or attempt the duck dive... But if you have to pull a donkey bail, which was all have to do regardless of your duckdiving skills, just move sideways as best you can and then let that mother go.

 

Death grip on the board, bear hug it while duck diving or turning turtle, and try to get through as much of the violence as possible for as long as possible while holding on. Obviously it might eventually get ripped away from you. This also decreases the chance of a snapped leash and long swim.

If i knew were people right behind me, straight up bailing would increase the chance of my board just shooting back and striking someone in the head.

 

"Break a toe"? So the extreme turbulence underwater is causing the board to hit you so hard that you're breaking toes? Or did you mean another word (i.e., autocorrect)?

 

Hey tropic surfer. In the conditions you describe I would have turned turtle and held on - probably as far forward on the board as possible. That way the front rocker of the gun would point the nose down as much as possible and you might just make it under most of the turmoil.

 

I should have better explained. In the toe breaking scenario, I scraped as hard as I could thinking I was going to make it over and about 10-15 yards before the wave got to me I realized that I had in fact put myself directly under the lip in the worst possible impact zone, so I pushed down through the bottom of the wave and to get extra deep, I put both feet on the back tailpad of my board and gave it one last push with my feet since the nose was about 5 feet below the tail, so I pushed the tail down with both feet and was probably 7-8 feet under water... The lip just passed over my head and it went down into the water right behind my back, so the lip itself came down underwater and gave the back 2 inches or so my my board a direct hit. I had both sets of my toes bent still on the tail and when the lip hit, it violently had the catipult effect and made the whole nose and top of the board spring into my body. Its broke two of my toes instantly. My big toe on my right foot still aches if I tweak it wrong sometimes.... But I did the right thing and got deep and used my feet and the impact just blast both of my feet. It hurt pretty bad. I still maintained control of the board though. I never lost it, I just had to bear hug it at that point. I stayed out another hour or so but could barely walk the next day.

 

In tall water, I normally just walk my board out. It's much safer than paddling out, plus it gives you more control of your board and it allows more time to prepare for a white wall. I simply flip my board over and tuck my nose just under the surface. 99% of the time, it works every time without my board flying into some dude's face. 1% of the time, your board will buckle/crack/break right in the middle where there is a little air pocket from the rocker inversion.

I'm still trying to figure out what to do with my halves...

 

this just happened to me. outside set came, first wave broke infront of me so i got under it. 2nd wave right on my head, ripped my board out. 3rd wave i said F it and dove to the bottom, came up to a snapped nose. so pissed. always try to hold onto your board.

 

Doing just about anything is better than bailing in a situation like the OP's. If you bail, your board is left at the surface to be picked up by the wall of whitewater and it will promptly snow plow into the guys behind you. A turtle roll or even a duck dive, that you know won't be successful, will at least get you and your board under the initial wall of white water. While everyone will probably still end up near each other, there is less chance that there will be a hard impact between fiberglass and their faces.

But the ocean can throw a lot of curve balls. Sometimes it's just not your day and sh1t happens.

 

Double overhead you are ditching and diving as deep as possible.

 

Yeah, I agree, as long as you don't have anybody directly behind you within leash range which is usually 6-8ft plus your board length. I know I haven't been in anything over 10-15 feet, but i've been pretty close to that and the one thing I always do is paddle to a spot that has nobody directly in front or behind of me and at least 6-8ft to the right / left of me. When it gets too crowded to the point where it doesn't matter what you do, then I get out, it's not worth it at that point IMO.

 

Yeah, I think now that I am back on the east coast...

A) I think the days of true DOH clean beach break days in Low Country will be few and far between, but yes out here it is FAR more dangerous to be in a crowd at a beach break.... so when the numbers get too high, its time to move down the way a bit.

B) In CA where DOH are common place in the winter, no one really surfs beach breaks... There are two beach breaks that I would surf in true DOH conditions... One is North PB and the other is Blacks... Aside from that, once its 6ft+ every beach break in town is a closeout and although you can maybe snap a nice wave here and there, the detonating conditions and various sets sizes never plays out... Out west, you simple go to a reef break or a point... And the scary thing about that is: I.E. Sunset Cliffs... You can paddle out on a 15+ft day through a channel and make the lineup with dry hair... No duck diving. I know the ins and outs of a few spots and it is a LOOOOONNNNG paddle, but you NEVER deal with the realities of the wave sized until you are in the lineup... With that being said, it creates a very confusing environment... Everyone gets really comfortable out there... start to pack together, jocking each other for position on the set waves, but then BAM, that rouge puppy starts coming and everyone realizes that they are basically on top of each other and then sh** happens. People get stuck in someones line that is riding the sets, cant get out of the way...The last minute scramble and dump.... It gets really bad when that happens cause everyone gets too comfortable...

I think back here on the east, if you are dealing with a true DOH scenerio, just the wearwithall to get out in those conditions and hold your ground already has everyone on their toes and they are ALWAYS paying attention. The currents, the drifting, the peakiness, the unpredictability of the beach breaks we have to surf... I feel like its cant be too common to be in a serious crowd out here in DOH conditions... which is true 10-12 foot surf....

Furthermore, this is no bash at swellinfo, but if you guys ever put in a surf report, it breaks down what the wave sizes are, and for instance, It considers waist high to be 3 feet. To mean, waist high is 1 foot. 3 feet is a solid head high wave face when you are riding... So there are many factors to consider, but based on the rational of this website and many east coast surfers it seems like, a true double overhead day here would be about 15 feet by their standards....

 

This post reminds me of the monster truck scene from the movie "Rat Race." So, you and your bros are hanging out in the lineup - pass after pass - waiting for the one. You're just sitting on top of your board, bobbing up and down, up one face, down the back - you really can't see the next wave until you get up top or you're on the backside. That's when you see a monster that's going to break way outside. You see it on everyones' faces - what do you do? Do you paddle for the shore and ride the white wash in a bit? Or do you take it like a man and paddle for it? Either way, it's one terrific cluster **** when this happens. That's when you start seeing the boards fly and the broken leashes.

You know how there's always a dude that's like "hey bro, do you have any wax?" I've seriously had one dude ask me if I had an extra leash on a big day.

 

That's gotta be a 1st, to that I would have to respond with something really smartass, "a spare leash? For what, to hang yourself with for being so unprepared?"