Glassed In VS Fin Systems?

I just know my first ?? boards had glassed on fins and they were fine until the fin roping started getting cancer, brittle, cracks, taking on water etc. No chance to try new fins easily...Foam blocks for travel...

Reglassing an old fin with a huge chunk of brittle resin stuck on the base of it is a pain in the ass.

I think most of the new fin systems are an improvement over glass on.

 

80% mental - 20% a difference that only .001% of the surfing population could notice.

Yes these percentages are 98% accurate.

 

I like glass-ons better, though it is nice being able to remove fins. If you hit a fin on the sandbar or reef, it will break off with glass ons, but with a fin box it could rip OUT. Much harder to repair. Plus, routing out the foam for the fin box takes away from the boards volume, so shaping becomes less accurate. But glass-ons add alot of weight...alot of which I think is as negligible as the missing foam.

Now I'm wondering which brand of fin box takes up the least amount of real estate. I'm leaning towards the old FCS plugs.

 

"there are 3 kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, & statistics."


i generally use FCS...i like the ability to try out different templates & tweak the fin set up to get the right "feel" from a board...i've generally found that, on thrusters, i like a center fin that is slightly smaller than the side fins. of course, FCS is problematic for me b/c i prefer the feel of solid fiberglass fins, as opposed to the plastic, composite, or even rtm fins & FCS doesn't do a whole lot w/ solid fiberglass. i'd like to switch over to lok-box b/c they do a lot of templates in solid fiberglass & marlin bacon or the 101 fin co. makes fins for lok-box as well & i love the feeling of bamboo fins, but i've accumulated so many FCS fins over the years that it's not practical at this point.
on my bonzers, i go w/ glass-on sides & a removable center fin, mostly b/c, as brian wynn explained to me, you get no advantage w/ the removable bonzer sides, & it's really hard to get the concaves placed correctly to make the design work. as far as travel, those little flaps are so low profile that they're a non-issue. never had a problem w/ them whatsoever.

 

Glass-ons provide superior flex pattern... no flex at the base, and max flex at the tip. A properly foiled fin is foiled not only from leading edge to thick point to trailing edge, but also from base to tip, so the fin will flex perfectly from base to tip, with the base not flexing at all, and the tip flexing the most.... just like a well foiled board... a smooth, continuously thinning foil from thick point to tips allows the board to flex like a bow... smooth, even flex pattern. No flex at the base means more drive and power out of the same sized fin, and a better flex response out of the rest of the fin... more "twang."

FCS plugs allow a degree of flex at the base, where there should be no flex. Full tab fin systems allow very little flex at the base, much like a glassed on fin. But many agree that FCS produces a better quality fin than most other major fin producers... better templates, foils, and materials... so there is some trade-off: A better fin overall might be worth the bit of flex at the base.

Choice of materials greatly influences fin flex. All personal preference here. Depending on the fin, I like the super light performance core fins with epoxy glass. Wood fins are my second choice (except for keels, in which case I prefer wood over everything else). Solid glass fins are my third choice, followed by plastic/composite fins.

Most pros ride fin systems more often than glassed on fins because they like the option of changing fins as the surf changes, not because they prefer the flex of a plugged or boxed fin over glassed on. Most pros show up with a selection of fins, just in case conditions change during a comp. If not, they'd most likely ride glassed on fins.

I never understood why someone would choose to put removable side runners on a Bonzer. Kind of defeats the purpose.

 

I think 101 will do fins for the FCS system

Biolos (...Lost/Mayhem) is working on hex core removable fins with this type of profile. Laying some carbon strips to stiffen the base and keeping the core out of the tip for added flex. Something along those lines anyway. Not sure if they are available yet.

 

i know guys who break fcs all the time.
i don't like how they aren't flush with the board.
i like futures;they are set in the board.
single fin = box,tri-quad futures,twin fin glass-ons

 

agree FCS are prone to plug blow outs.

As far as flex goes, not sure this affects flex MUCH but ive always throught it was a little wierd the way some FCS fins have the tabs partially off the base..i would also think most shapers locate the plugs where they want the fins to go, and then you buy these these fins that have tabs that shift the fins rearward (railward).

 

I think the distance between the trailing edge and the rear tab is the same on all the fins. The shorter the base on the fin, the further back the leading edge is moved. So the shaper's dot should pretty much line up with the trailing edge on all fins.

That's a pic of a sidebite fin, not a regluar thruster fin, so it has a very short base - less than 3.5 inches... all taken off the front of the fin.

 

Thanks LB,
That makes perfect sense!

 

They should make a weak seam in between the tab and the actual fin body on FCS. So when you hit something the fin breaks away from the tab easier than the plug pulling out.

The seam would have to be strong enough to stay in tact on the hardest cutback or snap but weak enough to break if there was a serious stress on it (like dropping it in the parking lot, running over a reef or hitting some driftwood).

This would require some major R&D to figure out what the tolerances would be but I think they can afford it since they get $60+ for three pieces of plastic...

 

I always thought that was part of their marketing....checked and the FCS website has this:

FCS 1 Year Limited Warranty

FCS offers a 1 year limited warranty against manufacturing defects and faulty workmanship. This does not include damage caused by misuse, inappropriate use or normal wear and tear. Faulty product validated under the warranty claim will be repaired or replaced at the discretion of FCS. FCS will not be responsible for any costs, losses or damages incurred as a result of loss or use of product. All warranty claims must be made at the place of purchase or directly with FCS. Proof of purchase (receipt with date of transaction) is essential for all warranty claims.

* All FCS molded composite fins are designed to break at the tabs when subjected to vigorous impact. This design feature aims to protect the integrity of the plug installation, and help prevent damage to the surfboard.

 

never had an issue w/ FCS plugs blowing out, & at 6'0" 195lbs, i'm not exactly a small guy. it's all in the install...if it's done right, there will be no problems. if corners are cut, then blow outs will happen. that's how it works w/ any system, tho. i don't believe that FCS is any more prone to failure than any other. in fact, the only systems i've not seen blow out are red-x & lok-box.

if marlin makes fins for FCS, that must be a recent thing, b/c when i last talked to him last spring, he was still only doing lok-box & glass ons. i'll have to check that out. i'd love a set of bamboo thruster fins!

 

Absolutely agree.... Out of all the blown out plugs I've re-done, only one was properly installed. And that one was a weird one... with a big rail ding right next to the plug that was missing.

Damage is one thing. Performance is another...

 

I only have one board with glass ons and it's a fish with big keel fins. The fins feel more responsive and drivier. But that might just be because they have such a long base. I have a 6' C Hawk on the way from Chris Christenson with glass on double foiled bamboo 101s. I'm pretty syked to try it out. It's a twin fin for hurricane surf.

 

the two local guys i know who totally rip have fcs blowouts for no apparent reason other than powerful surfing in size with boards by merrick,MR and simon.nothing faulty there,and no blowouts with futures;they had to switch.i'm light-footed so never had a problem with fcs,but just look at them and you don't need to be a genius to see the design is flawed and flimsy compared to futures

 

I have only had shortboards with future systems and I like them for the better part.. For my longboard I prefer and glassed on but for me its not a option that is workable . I like the try differnt fins too much . Diffent beaches and days call for differnt fins

 

the bahne/fins unlimited box is definitely the best bet for singles, logs, 2+1's, & bonzers...the adjustability is crucial to making those board perform the best they can. you can learn a lot about fin placement & whatnot if you really geek out over it!

 

i actually have a board with glassed in fins and a board with a fin system and it all depends on the conditions to which one i ride and prefer. though glassed on fins suck when they break, they are a pain to get fixed