Impact of Navy SONAR and Explosive Testing & Training on Marine Mammals

Discussion in 'All Discussions' started by DosXX, Dec 10, 2013.

  1. DosXX

    DosXX Well-Known Member

    Mar 2, 2013
    http://hamptonroads.com/2013/12/navy-says-training-could-kill-dozens-sea-mammals

    To me, studies like these tend to generate more questions than answers.

    Who actually conducted this study - the Navy or a contractor paid by the Navy? Was there an expected or desired outcome from this study?
    What methodology was used? Was most of it done using modeling and simulation on a computer? Who performed the tasks involved in this study: data techs, interns, new hires (from Craig's List?), or someone with actual experience and wisdom in this field?
    Buzzwords and phrases like: "temporary", "short term", "negligible long-term effects", and "not having any significant impact on the environment" in the context of this article tend to raise flags.

    But what's more important, our national security or a the lives of a "negligible" number of dolphins and whales? There are always trade-offs. If this testing is important, what possible additional steps can be taken to minimize "collateral damage"?
     
  2. DosXX

    DosXX Well-Known Member

    Mar 2, 2013
    The link forwards you to a subscription site after about 20 seconds. I apologize for the problem. If I can find another way to post the article (for anyone interested) I'll try again.
     

  3. DosXX

    DosXX Well-Known Member

    Mar 2, 2013
  4. KookieMonster

    KookieMonster Well-Known Member

    488
    Jan 13, 2012
    They should send that Paul Watson guy against the Navy.. that guy is a joke. Too bad that the military is no joke.. god luck trying to get them to really change their policy. Plus do you want ruskies and nazis piloting submarines to new york?
     
  5. brewengineer

    brewengineer Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2011
    Humans are ****s to the planet. The military is pretty much the leader in not caring about the environment. If we don't care about vaporizing an entire island, why would we care about a few whales/dolphins?
     
  6. aka pumpmaster

    aka pumpmaster Well-Known Member

    Apr 30, 2008
    [​IMG]

    I love the smell of fallout in the morning. It smells like victory.
     
  7. ClemsonSurf

    ClemsonSurf Well-Known Member

    Dec 10, 2007
    Looks like some nice off-shore winds.
     
  8. goosemagoo

    goosemagoo Well-Known Member

    900
    May 20, 2011
    Are those ships empty and there as a test?? Otherwise they did the army equivalent of pulling the pin on a grenade and forgetting to throw the dam thing.
     
  9. AndrewIfallalot

    AndrewIfallalot Well-Known Member

    155
    Aug 24, 2012
    That was a test to see the effectiveness of atomic weapons against ships.

    Re: the OP, this testing and damage it causes to marine mammals is reason # 23841324 why we need massive military cuts
     
  10. seldom seen

    seldom seen Well-Known Member

    Aug 21, 2012
    I would guess those ships in the pic are empty, but the govt. definitely put soldiers at various distances from nuclear explosions(in other tests) to determine harm from radiation and such.
     
  11. brewengineer

    brewengineer Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2011
  12. HARDCORESHARTHUFFER-RI

    HARDCORESHARTHUFFER-RI Well-Known Member

    Sep 17, 2013
    The new sonar is super gnarly too, it will cause the Nitrogen and Oxygen that is dissolved in the tissues of marine mammals to come out of solution, aka form bubbles that grow with every passing sonar/sound wave, so the body tissue is being ripped from the inside by constantly growing air bubbles. Depth and therefore pressure also play a role in this process

    This process is called rectified diffusion and is torturous. The marine mammals will beach themselves to get out of the sound field that causes their insides to tear apart

    here is a link
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11894990

    more links:
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16006604

    Gas bubble-associated lesions and fat embolism were observed in the vessels and parenchyma of vital organs. In vivo bubble formation associated with sonar exposure that may have been exacerbated by modified diving behavior caused nitrogen supersaturation above a threshold value normally tolerated by the tissues (as occurs in decompression sickness). Alternatively, the effect that sonar has on tissues that have been supersaturated with nitrogen gas could be such that it lowers the threshold for the expansion of in vivo bubble precursors (gas nuclei). Exclusively or in combination, these mechanisms may enhance and maintain bubble growth or initiate embolism. Severely injured whales died or became stranded and died due to cardiovascular collapse during beaching. The present study demonstrates a new pathologic entity in cetaceans. The syndrome is apparently induced by exposure to mid-frequency sonar signals and particularly affects deep, long-duration, repetitive-diving species like BWs. (beaked whales)
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2013
  13. chicharronne

    chicharronne Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2006
  14. Special Whale Glue

    Special Whale Glue Well-Known Member

    Oct 8, 2011
    Whales and dolphins aren't the only things washing up dead from the sound blasts. Schools of mermaids have been washing up too. Most people haven't seen the mermaids because zagaffer collects them instantly.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2013
  15. sisurfdogg

    sisurfdogg Well-Known Member

    Jun 17, 2013
    Don't mess with the mermaids! You will end up cursed, unable to catch fish or waves.

    Don't mess with the U.S. Armed Forces either. It is a gnarly tradeoff: homeland security v. marine mammal/oceanic health and wellness. Guess who wins.
     
  16. Special Whale Glue

    Special Whale Glue Well-Known Member

    Oct 8, 2011
    ^^^^^^Not mermaids and whales? "But why manboy, why?"
     
  17. DosXX

    DosXX Well-Known Member

    Mar 2, 2013
    No one was on board those ships during the test. I believe the photo was from one of the atomic bomb tests conducted at the Bikini Atoll in 1946. Other than nuke fallout, I don't think environmental impact was a major concern.
     
  18. DosXX

    DosXX Well-Known Member

    Mar 2, 2013
    This is interesting information about a very nasty and not well known effect of SONAR on cetaceans. Usually you read about how SONAR temporarily affects the mammals' hearing and behavior, causes disorientation, etc. The two articles aren't recent: 2001 and 2005.
     
  19. HARDCORESHARTHUFFER-RI

    HARDCORESHARTHUFFER-RI Well-Known Member

    Sep 17, 2013
    You might be able to search for more recent info
    ....then again, the data might be buried/ignored/proprietary/Corzined, etc
     
  20. DosXX

    DosXX Well-Known Member

    Mar 2, 2013
    Thanks for sharing those articles, MIS.