Paying for someone else's healthcare? So just let homeless people die? What if you get sick and lose your health insurance? Or lose your job? What about handing out organs based on who can pay the most? Yeah all those people hoping for cancer so they can get their free handout. Every single modern free voting first world country has universal health care. It was a disgrace that the U.S. didn't have universal health insurance. Thankfully Obama is heading us in the right direction. You also pay for police? Do you have police insurance? Government has a role in public safety. Health care is a public safety issue and should be paid for through taxes like medicare. Excessive government spending for non essentials is another matter entirely. This is a surfing forum. Go elsewhere. Edit: Oh I just realized this was posted in non-surf related.
Here is an article with a lot of information. It isn't the entire state of California. Sorry I misquoted since I read the article a long time ago. Rather, it's several hospitals in California and Texas that say 70% of the babies are to illegals. I'm sure that's fine with you. Do you know how much it costs to have a baby delivered in a hospital? Many of these hospitals have shut down because of it. The article shows the costs of illegals and the drain on the econonmy. We spend 29% (100 billion) of our education budget on anchor babies. sickening. All of these stats and it's a liberal media source. Numbers are probably higher. The article below also explains that the 14th amendment was for slaves when they had children. It wasn't designed to be used by illegals to get benefits. Repeal this amendment. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michealene-cristini-risley/the-14th_b_1343158.html
Liam it sounds like you just printed out the script from a mancow or rush Limbaugh show. I'm calling you out: AGE AND OCCUPATION because I have a sneaky feeling that you are like 17 years old and live at home in a nice nieghborhood. and for a control, I voted for Ron Paul and I think that Obama is and was an awful president. I couldn't even take Romney seriously.
everybody should read this: http://www.gao.gov/products/GAO-11-318SP prime example of what is wrong with government today. PS--Shark-hunter, if Obamacare is so great why are costs skyrocketing and the number of exemptions to his political cronies growing? Shouldn't there be NO exemptions if it was this awesome panacea?
Lol, this is funny, and next you'll tell us how bad the economy is...as the markets set new highs, unemployment falls, housing purchases are on the rise....stop reading so much propaganda and open your eyes....if Obamacare was killing the medical industry, then explain their record growth over the past 2 years... Facts are facts jack, most people in this country are making money right now, if you're not.....might need to look in the mirrior and quit blaming Obama.
Did I or did I not say illegal immigration was a problem? I said it was and then merely suggested that it might be more effective to give illegals a path to citizenship rather than spending hundreds of billions deporting them and creating a lot of negativity within immigrant communities (legal and illegal). In the short run, it might be "cheaper" to deport people, but you risk creating some serious ill will among their legal immigrant friends and families. Are there criminals among them? Sure, but there are plenty of criminals among every race and class (even middle class white surfers). I'm sure there are plenty of hard working people among the illegal immigrant population that are just trying to make a better life for their children - just like our ancestors did. Also, I did not say that they should skip to the front of the line in terms of citizenship. I said create a path. Of course anyone currently waiting to become a citizen should get the opportunity before someone who came here illegally. Make it so that illegals can get a tax ID number and pay taxes and become part of productive society. Should violent criminals be deported? Yes. In the future, do yourself a favor and don't resort to ad hominem arguments. It only serves to undermine your real point and make you look petty. Yes, I live in Brooklyn. I loathe hipsters because for the most part they are lazy, non-productive leeches that do nothing but drive up rents in neighborhoods that used to be working class. We don't need anymore organic pickle farms.
Lee, that is a liberal media source not Rush the retard. There are plenty of other sources. Why don't you just look. I'm sure you are an illegal or you employ them. That's why you don't debate it. You benefit off of them. Did you see the facts in the paper or do you need the director of foreign affairs to actually speak with you directly. Keep drinking the cool aid. I'm 39. I"m a marine biologist and also have a real estate license. I only make a modest living in a blue-collar neighborhood. I do see illegals looking for rentals that qualify for big section 8 housing first hand. Others don't even have a SSN. They get mad when I ask for an SSN for a credit check. Sorry, no SSN and drivers license, no rental. See you! Go find a slumlord. I'll protect my client's house from people where we can't even verify criminal history. Lee, what is your occupation and how old are you? Please show some pics of you surfing. I'm sure you shred or wait were you called out for being a poseur.
Where did I say any of this was fine with me? You say you've read all these studies and spout various vague statistics about illegal immigration. I take 2 minutes to look into one of these so called statistics and find that you were completely wrong. In the future, if you going to say things like, "Stats show...", make sure they actually show that. Again, your undermining yourself when you say something and anyone who is willing to take 2 minutes to look into it can find that it's not true.
This thread is badly in need of a happy hour drink and some causal conversation about babes and playoffs and spring. Oh wait....thats what I need.
Did you read the article slick? It showed the stats I talked about. Actually, the cost of illegals was higher in this article than what I said. I read a lot on illegals but I don't keep a bibliography. As you can see, the article showed the problem with anchor babies and how it's killing hospitals. Education and prison costs are ridiculuous too. Let's all hold hands and save the world. Let's all make these criminals citizens. Why should I folllow the law when these people don't follow any of the laws? They break the law crossing our border. They break the law by having too many people occupy a rental which violates code enforcement laws. They drive without licenses and insurance. They steal SSNs and identities. The list goes on and on. The problem is that they are never held accountable until they kill someone while they are driving drunk without a license. Then, they are finally deported.
All of them do these things? And I'm sorry, but you've noted many other "facts" from various studies and articles for which you have not provided support. Regardless, I'm not trying to derail this thread into a discussion about illegals. We can start a separate thread about that if you want and you can post up all of your readings on illegals and how they are solely responsible for destroying the country. Like I said, it's an issue. Would you like to offer up a more realistic suggestion than deporting all of them? Think about the logistics of that. Are you just going to have the police start asking for ID from anybody who is brown and if they can't provide it, first bus to Mexico? Welcome to Nazi America. To be honest and try to get this thread back on track, I tend to lean to the right politically, but do not agree with much of what the Republican party has said or done in recent history. I'm for less government in my life, more personal responsibility. I think a flat tax would be ideal, but will probably never happen, so if it has to be progressive, let's lower the marginal rates and eliminate ALL deductions. I don't think we should be influencing decisions with tax policy. Same with corporate taxes - 20-25% with no deductions. Socially, as long as you're responsible and not infringing on other's rights I don't care what you do. So if you're gay and want to get married, be my guest. Religion has no business legislating social policy in this country.
Not deflecting, you're just harping on a minor issue....I'm showing you the macro-view of it....we can sit here and pinpoint irregularities or hypocrisy of both parties if you pull out the microscope....The overall health of the economy and healthcare industry profits are both on the upswing...so whats the problem? Nothing's perfect my friend, especially in politics, but to harp on exemptions when it comes to Obamacare and ignore the infinite amount of corporate tax exemptions is a bit one sided...you're essentially beef in that poor, uneducated people are bleeding us dry...but I'd beg to differ.... http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/Articles/2011/02/09/10-Big-Corporate-Tax-Breaks.aspx#page1 Combine corporate tax breaks of $180 billion last year and the ultra-inflated military budget...you're talking big money... http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/federal_budget_detail_fy12bs12012n Read between the lines my friend, you are so concerned about low level healthcare exemption yet have no problem pouring tax dollars into and inflated military and allowing the corporate tax rate to be butchered to death with "exemptions" and loopholes....this even bring up another argument....the greatest joke in American politics....Reaganomics. (i.e. trickle down taxation) By Reagan's logic, the lower the corporate tax rate the more money they have to hire and research, yet starting in Januray 2008 corporate tax rates were slashed and yet unemployment rose significantly and corporate profits followed suit. You, seem to like Reagan, as did I, when I was 18 and naive. However, a little research into issues such as: Iran Contra, Inslaw Affair, and the Saving and Loan Scandal, may open your eyes a bit, but I doubt it. Look, I'm a registered LIB, so def not an Obama supporter, but I still can't let you get away with grossly blaming him for all that is wrong in your life. Once again, most people are making money right now (especially the Health Insurance companies you empathize with so much) so whats the problem...some low income citizen exemptions that are dwarfed by the corporate and military machine? Idk seems illogical to me...but what the hell do I know!
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/02/21/us-usa-immigration-idUSBRE91K01A20130221 The majority of Americans want them deported. A democracy does what the people want. Is government listening to the people. We say deport them!!
big difference between being called a poseur and being called out on being a poseur. Have you forgotten? I don't owe you anything. I'm 27 and I babysit a computer all day. No food stamps here. Whole foods or GTFO.
#1, Contrary to popular opinion (and a reflection of our outstanding public school system), the US is not a democracy. It is a democratic republic, so you will have to get your elected officials to pass some kind of legislation for wholesale deportation. #2, the article you cite is a poll, not a vote. It is a poll of 1,443 people. Surely representative of all the views of some 300 million Americans. Either way, if you want to continue this discussion, please start a thread about illegals.
Yes we are a republic which doesn't serve the people anymore. It's bought out by corporations. It should represent the majority and deport illegals. Polls are usually very accurate. There should be a vote as you say though. That will show the people's will just like it did in Arizona.
Solution - flat corporate tax rate with no deductions. Takes the power away from politicians - no $ = no favors.
Remember fellas ........attack the issues not each other. Thank you. You guys are the creme of the crop on this site. Behave yoursleves in a dignified manner. Thank you.
