Surfboard design has left me behind

Discussion in 'Surfboards and Surfboard Design' started by Toonces, Nov 21, 2016.

  1. Toonces

    Toonces Well-Known Member

    Apr 25, 2016
    I figured I'd revisit this thread 8-9 months on.

    I have taken the Byrne out a few times now, in some head high Cape Cod surf and most recently during the Irma swell for a second session when I wanted more float for an easier paddle.

    With a few sessions under my belt, I have to admit that I made a mistake on the Easy Rider. Yes, it floats awesome and paddles like a dream. I never thought I'd say this, but it might be just too much foam. It's in an uncomfortable spot where it's not enough foam to ride like a true funboard, but it's too much foam to ride like a shortboard. It doesn't seem to do anything well.

    I got weapons free from the wife to buy a new board. I took another look at the Flyer 2, and was set to pull the trigger, but then reconsidered. Setting it next to my "everyday" board, it definitely has a lot more volume. Probably a good thing going into winter, but long term, I'm just not sure it's the right call. Something keeps holding me back from buying.

    So....TL;DR, I think I'm going to just spend the money and pick up either a Quiver Killer or V3 Rocket. From everything I've read, I think the Quiver Killer is the right call for me. I did the ...Lost volume calculator, and at my weight and skill level my sweet spot appears to be 30-35L, so I'm going to split the difference and look at 33L. (5'4, 175lbs, average fitness and ability). It looks like the 6'0 in stock dimensions comes in right at 33L.

    I know this is heresy to y'all, but a 6'0 is an extremely short board for me. All told this will end up being close to $1000 out the door with deck pad, fins, and leashe, so I hope it's not a super-costly mistake. But just this once, I'm going to take a chance on one of these new fangled "modern" shapes.
  2. Toonces

    Toonces Well-Known Member

    Apr 25, 2016
    I'm probably talking to myself at this point, but it's cathartic.

    Obviously I've been eyeballing that same Flyer 2 for more than a year now, and it's not moving which in and of itself is concerning. I honestly don't care what everyone else rides, but if the board was a killer it should have moved by now; it's reasonably priced.

    When I went in between Irma sessions to eat and give the shoulders a break, I saw someone had brought in a custom CI 6'3 Black Beauty. Oh man do I love that shape. I had one, a long time ago but narrower, and I had trouble riding it and sold it off. But, that was like 15 years ago, and just holding it, next to the Flyer 2, it was like the BB was speaking to me..."Buy me Toonces...we can have oh so much fun together!"

    But, man. You just flip them over and look at the bottom. The Flyer 2 is benign compared to the BB, which is just insane. The V is incredible. And everything but everything I've read say it's a good-wave board. It might work at a RI reef break, but then, I don't consider a 6'3 a "step up" when my current everyday board is a 6'6.

    My emotions want this board so bad, perfect 33L volume and just a beautiful, comfortable shape. And this threw all my consideration of the Flyer out the window. Now I'm comparing these two boards, and realizing that neither is really, probably the right board.

    And, FWIW, I'm partial to Channel Islands boards. I realize the mark up, but truth is, I've always like them. My most favoritest boards have always been CI's. I've never owned a ...Lost; I think the logo is ugly and I'm not some punker dude. But, I look on the CI site and I just don't see an equivalent to either the V3 or the QK.

    I guess it's time to take that leap. This will be very interesting. I haven't bought a new PU board for something like...gosh, I can't even remember. Call it 15 years at least. Oh my.

  3. Toonces

    Toonces Well-Known Member

    Apr 25, 2016
    But, looking at surfing style, I'm not a "pocket" surfer. Just looking at my own GoPro videos, I'm definitely in the "carve" style of surfing. I think I have a neutral foot stance, and I don't get all tricky or vertical. I like to lay the board on a rail, when I can, and just carve. Nice, slow, carves.

    The Black Beauty is built for that, but I'm concerned that it's just not going to work somewhere like Second Beach.

    And, I'm apparently moving to San Diego next June for 3+ years, and nothing has indicated that the BB works well in average SD surf. The Quiver Killer and V3, though, seem to get the nod.

    I had not going CI for this much money, though.
  4. Son Bather Bob

    Son Bather Bob Well-Known Member

    Jun 16, 2014
    Start saving up now! My rent is 1,700 for a studio. No joke! (I can see the ocean from my window though)
  5. raddadbrad

    raddadbrad Well-Known Member

    Jan 10, 2015
    I used to ride similar boards that your riding till I bought a 5'8" rusty dwart. The board was 33.5 liters (the same as my old hp shortboards) but this boards paddled faster ,caught waves easier, and was super stable on the pop. Real eye opener! Im currently super stoked on the Lost Puddle jumper @ 5'6"... The board grovels great and holds in up to shoulder high barrels. My next purchase is a p/u Round pin puddle jumper @5'8"-5'10" (about 35 liters for the 5mil.) higher range and float. Check em out and pull da trigga !!!! you won't be bummed I promise
  6. Toonces

    Toonces Well-Known Member

    Apr 25, 2016
    I plan on buying, my "forever home" and it is kind of shocking. We'll see how it goes.

    But WRT surfboard design, I just don't know what to listen to anymore. I'm listening to this review:


    I can't relate.

    The problem with the Salas reviews, is that they're such good and fit surfers. I don't know how many of they apply to, or how many of us think they apply to us, but not.

    Salas is 5'9, 170 lbs. and in his videos you can tell he's very fit, and can surf well. Honestly, you could put him on any range of boards and he'll kill. But then he's pulling up sufboards where he's riding boards at 5'7, several inches below his height, like it's nothing.

    I'm left trying to figure out where I am in this calculus. Like, I get it you're a pro, but scale up for us everyday surfers, you know?

    I'm inclined to stick to my gut, and the lost calculator. 6'0 seems short for me. Let's see how that goes.
  7. Toonces

    Toonces Well-Known Member

    Apr 25, 2016
  8. raddadbrad

    raddadbrad Well-Known Member

    Jan 10, 2015
    This is a close minded MISTAKE BRO! don't buy that POS!!! Go watch some Trip Foreman videos on first!!
  9. Mr.Belmar

    Mr.Belmar Well-Known Member

    Aug 19, 2010
    Hey toonces

    I had a flyer 2 for a while (just sold it...) for many years it was my go to board for bigger winter surf since it had a good amount of volumn. I would say it's a great all around, standard board. Good in almost all waves... but has its limitations... one thing I didn't like about it - was that my particular board had pretty thick / fat rails though would often get hung up.. so check the rails on the board in the shop. I had a 6'6 or 6'8, I forget.. over all I liked it, for a basic no frills board. But did get bored of it... but it was good for cruising and carving.

    I can't speak to the other boards you mentioned... except the BB- which your right, it has a beautiful shape but only works good in steeper powerful good waves.

    Brad mentioned the rusty Dwart - I always liked that shape and sounds like it's something you might like as well... I would check that one out. Rusty also makes some other models that seem similar, might be worth checking out...
  10. raddadbrad

    raddadbrad Well-Known Member

    Jan 10, 2015
    NP Toonces!! The only guys riding these 2 1/4 performance chips are pros surfing contests. If your just trying to have as much fun as possible on your days off work like me. GET WHAT WORKS! Im a alternative shape whore now, just cuz they are that fun and effortless to rip on! Good luck bro LMK what you choose and the out come.
  11. beachbreak

    beachbreak Well-Known Member

    Apr 7, 2008
    Um, real watersports, um trip forman, um... Next topic.

    Volume, ok. But, length, width, nose/tail width, nose/tail shape, outline, rails, rocker, bottom contour, fins, etc., etc., etc....

    I have watched far better surfers than me, in critical surf, have their pos cl too short boards make them surf far worse and make it much more difficult for them because they think they can cheat reality and make volume the solution to ripping like slater/fanning/reynolds.

    They are ripping, but only a very small percentage of them.

    It makes ugly, drawbacks surfers of them all in these critical jersey waves.

    The 70's and early 80's did almost the same thing, shortboards 5'10" pushed down to 5'6", reality set in and life once again began at 6'2".

    The little boards are good for friendly surf, but that rarely happens here.
  12. raddadbrad

    raddadbrad Well-Known Member

    Jan 10, 2015
    Wow! You have some problem with Trip? He's an average surfer that samples every board made for the average surfers , very informative on all the new shapes. Nothing starts at 6'2" for me except maybe my step up from my step up that gets dusted off once or twice a winter. I don't know where you live in Jersey but "The critical waves of Jersey" Huh?? 80% of Jerseys waves are friendly except for hurricane swell. Like I surfed all day in Belmar on my 5'9" roberts dreamcatcher witch I ride all winter with no problems at all, the board tops out at 8-10' barreling waves. Also Im pretty sure the man seeking advice here is a smaller guy like 5'4" 175lbs. If he's on a 6'2" Id bet his feet wouldn't even hit the correct sweet spot on the board. But what ever bro Im sure you opinion is valued. Peace!
  13. Toonces

    Toonces Well-Known Member

    Apr 25, 2016
    I managed to fondle a few boards today. Then I went back on host's website. I'm thinking perhaps going with the mini driver instead of the quiver killer. There's a nice stock 6'2 that is right at 33 liters. I like the idea of a more traditional template.
  14. CarolinaCutback

    CarolinaCutback Well-Known Member

    Jul 27, 2017
    Toonces... I've had three mini-drivers over several years. They are GREAT all around boards. If you're not a great surfer, you're not going to be riding double overhead waves, which is the limit for a mini-driver. If you get it with enough volume, you can ride it in thigh high waves too. If you can actually surf, you will love that board.

    Not to complicate things further, but I switched from ... Lost to Pyzel for my good wave boards. I did so for two main reasons... my last few ... Losts have not lasted long (maybe one season of regular riding) and I think Pyzel has passed Biolos as the most dialed shaper of good wave boards. If you could only have two boards, a Pyzalien and a Ghost would cover just about everything. If you really need a groveller... just get a locally shaped Mini-Simmons... they are hard to screw up and you can support a local.
  15. LBCrew

    LBCrew Well-Known Member

    Aug 12, 2009
    'Cause they work in lengths over 6'. It's a totally different set of curves, compared to the 5'8s that are so popular right now.

    Just be careful, Toonces... I think you're looking at a stock volume of closer to 36L than 33. I'd check that again before you pull the trigger.
  16. beachbreak

    beachbreak Well-Known Member

    Apr 7, 2008
    No problem with REAL, um, i mean Trip. He is the greatest guy, i guess.

    But i would rather talk to Scott and Curtis.

    I am not arguing that you do not surf my strip of sand. South and north of me are more user-friendly.

    And you proved my point. As i said we are not all ripping 8'-10' barrels.

    You rip. But so did tom curren. On a 6'2" thruster. Proven.

    Yet to see the under 5'10" work any better than that.

    Where i come from the waves are difficult. If you can surf this, you can surf anywhere in the world.

    I know what i see. Talented surfers surfing boards made for pros on perfect points. Like you, i guess. Not me, nor maybe this toonces, either.

    And our waves are not their waves. I surf beachbreaks.
  17. DawnPatrol321

    DawnPatrol321 Well-Known Member

    Mar 6, 2012
    Buying a new surfing boart isn't meant to be this difficult. Toonces, stop over analyzing it. If you've been surfing as long as you say you have and in places like Hawaii then there is no reason why you shouldn't know what works for you.

    If you continue to buy off the racks, you'll probably keep having these problems. Get in touch with a reputable shaper, local or not, and trust them to build you a boart that is suitable for your size, ability, and conditions you'll be surfing in.

    If you let the shaper do his thing and trust in him, you'll end up with the right boart more times than not. I will NEVER buy off the rack again after 3 customs, ever. Pay the same or less, get exactly what you NEED and have more fun. Why would you do anything else? You've been at this for a while now, surely you're sick of trying to figure it out.
  18. JayD

    JayD Well-Known Member

    Feb 6, 2012
    Interesting vibe brewing here on personal preference and experimentation.

    It has taken me a solid 6-8 years of experimentation after living in Hi for a decade to find a board that is right for "me" on the EC. I have surfed PR, CR, and Indo in the interim with various boards too...all custom boards but two.

    Everyone is different. I am currently surfing the most foam (6'2", 2 5/8', 20 1/2") I have surfed as my "short board". Part of the fun of surfing IMO is experimentation.

    Rad is hooked on a few boards made by the name brands and is stoked. I choose to ride local shaper boards and each one is shaped with a purpose...whether Indo or Hatteras or sloppy sandbar surf, I approach it with what I think is going to work for me. And frankly after 30+ years I'm still learning and experimenting.

    Have fun with it and don't stress. If cash flow is a problem be more deliberate but you can still experiment and move on with out too much of a loss if it does not work. I sold my 5'11" b/c it I realized I'm not 30 YO and 175 anymore (not that a 5'11" shaped proper could not work for me today...I just chose to go longer with this latest experiment). Custom board I surfed a 1 1/2 years and sold for 2 bills. My 6'4" range boards I fine with b/c I surf them in heavier (relatively speaking) surf. It's the waist to shoulder surf board that I'm finding I need to explore more. I sold 4 boards on CL this past year no problem. Experiment and keep moving along til you find the magic stick!
  19. DawnPatrol321

    DawnPatrol321 Well-Known Member

    Mar 6, 2012
    I forgot to mention, working with a good shaper not only helps you get the right boart for you, but you'll learn a lot if you ask the right questions and listen to them. I learned so much about boart design on each boart that was built for me. A good shaper will educate you throughout the process. It makes the next boart that much easier. There's always room to learn, but after a few I guarantee you your knowledge on the subject will grow and you'll be less reluctant on the whole process.
  20. LBCrew

    LBCrew Well-Known Member

    Aug 12, 2009
    ^^^Solid advice in the last couple of posts.