Vote Today?

Discussion in 'All Discussions' started by zach619, Nov 4, 2014.

Did you Vote today (Nov 4)

Poll closed Nov 6, 2014.
  1. Yes I voted

    34 vote(s)
    59.6%
  2. No I didn't

    23 vote(s)
    40.4%
  1. brewengineer

    brewengineer Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2011
    I don't see why people are so unhappy. I am guessing it goes back to the lack of intelligence in the world. People don't think for themselves and want others to tell them how they should feel about things. Let's ignore the low gas prices, economical improvements, housing market bounce back, and manufacturing industry growth. Nope, everything sucks. Personally, I don't vote. I hate politicians and don't trust many if them. I can't align myself with the left or the right, but the two party system is here to stay. All that aside, I am personally happy. I think people just forget that politicians have always sucked. Get over it and live your life. Vote for a person you don't hate, and if that person doesn't win, get over it. Priests and politicians are two things we need less of in this world.
     
  2. brewengineer

    brewengineer Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2011
    That is the opposite of Charleston. Most of the GOP is pro development here. The coastal conservation group is mostly left wing. However, our mayor is a democrat and doesn't give a **** about anything but money and the rich.
     

  3. zach619

    zach619 Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2009
    To me, its an honest reality. The poor in this country have gotten poorer in the last 6 years. Although jobs are growing again, with population increases, they are still FAR behind where they were. More people LOST health care from the Obamacare situation than the 32 Million that got it. South Carolina dropped their services immediately and a dozen other states followed suit. So, more people got screwed than not.

    Yes, the housing market is coming back, but it is ALMOST impossible to get a mortgage unless you have an abundance of cash, so again, Joe the plumber and the common man are not seeing the opportunities to actually get a home.

    Private insurance is more expensive than it has ever been. No company will even fund childbirth. Policy holders, such as myself have seen services decline and prices increase.

    We pulled out of war, it backfired, things are worst over there than they have been in 10 years, now we are ramping back up.

    There is more racial tension in this country than there has been in 3 decades.

    The borders are wide open. In my county alone, there have been 50 children dispersed into our public school system from mexico....

    The only positives I have seen in this country in 6 years, are that gay marriage, legalization of pot and some cool social issues seem to be getting resolved, but NONE Of these things affect me or most people in this country.....

    It's about false promises and smoke and mirrors. The premise in which Obama ran on was a scam. He probably THOUGHT he could get all this done, but he went about it the wrong way....

    Before rolling out obama care, he should have thought about reforming the insurance markets, which are the enemy here. They are the ones controlling it. Costs have sky rocketed for normal people....

    If you work for a living, you do NOT qualify for any of these programs, yet you probably don't make enough money to supply it on your own.....

    I could keep going. I am just saying, 8 years ago, I had SWEET healthcare at a reasonable cost. The economy was booming. Yeah, people complained about the war in Iraq, thats about it... Now look at us.

    Everyone wanted to keep Big Government and Corporations out of the redevelopment of the middle east. Mission accomplished, and we are falling apart because of it. We should have just let the governement do what they do best, be crooked and make a sh**load of money. Who cares if Haliburton funnels Billions every year into the middle east and monoploizes all the contracts. That means that we would have already taken over the whole damn region. ISIS would have never gotten out of the gates. There would be half naked muslim women going into McDonalds in Baghdad.....

    In retrospect, does that really sound so bad?

    I could keep going. But there is a reason why almost 8 out of 10 people in this country are unhappy with the current administration. And it's not because the voters lack information or smarts. These are the same voting pools that have always hung around the 50/50 mark. They were no "more educated" in years past than they are now....

    I would love to hear from someone who is truly happy with the current state of government. I really want to know how you feel about it. Cause I am not on board at all right now. We are slowly turning into a mockery.
     
  4. worsey

    worsey Well-Known Member

    Oct 13, 2013
    those numbers assume people are qualified and educated enough and inclined to answer questions in a socially
    responsible manner.

    sigh.
     
  5. zach619

    zach619 Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2009
    Agreed. But this is true for EVERY exit poll. They were no more qualified or educated in the past then they are now. And the numbers are an honest reflection, regardless of what they tell us.

    Just look at the questions to. Like 74% of people are certain that we have an imminent terrorist attack coming. It's just an interesting look at our country. This is not "new" information, the general polls have been indicating this for years now.

    The Majority of people in this country are LEFT, but they hate what their own party is doing. Ironic.

    Interesting if nothing more.
     
  6. brewengineer

    brewengineer Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2011
    Am I completely happy with the government? No. Have I ever been? No. The reality is that things have never been that great before. When you were living the good life, the economy was on borrowed time. Health care costs are the reason for the loss of coverage. More people are overweight (because this country lives in excess), so there are increased health issues. Again, you may not see it, but those of us in the manufacturing and engineering sector are back to where we used to be before the recession. That gives me a small glimmer of hope with the current leadership. I just bought a house, btw. It isn't that hard to get a mortgage. Don't listen to talking heads that tell you otherwise. The Middle East has never been a good subject and we rarely make good decision in that region. Again, show me a time when this was different. I guess I am trying to say this is a same old same old situation.
    Obamacare didn't realistically harm anyone directly. The situation in SC was due to our right wing leadership fighting it and causing thousands of people to be left with nothing.

    Americans had it too easy in the past.
     
  7. zach619

    zach619 Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2009
    I bought a home 13 months ago. I speak from experience. The process was a complete cluster fu**. Better now? Yes? Make sure we are qualified? Yes.... But for the average person, unless you have 20K in CASH money, you ain't buying sh**. Even on a FM loan, you are looking at 3.5 down plus closing costs of up to 10K depending on the homes value. You are looking at $13K down for the lowest of loans on the market. I got a great rate and all that, but it was like getting freaking Secret Service clearance to even get it done. So again, I am speaking from first hand experience here.

    Yes, we are in the same old situation, but I disagree with the reasons. The US has always been FAT. Always. In 2006, we were no "less fat" as we are now.

    I will give you an example, again, first hand... In San Diego, my daughter was born at Mary Birch Scripps hospital. One of the best in the nation. I had great insurance, paid a bit for it, but in our ENTIRE pregnancy and delivery, we paid $200.00. When it was all said and done, we got mailed a bill, just to show us how much the insurance paid: Almost $60K... Thats right, 60 thousand dollars. What I noticed, was that the second our insurance cleared, the nurses, doctors and everyone opened the flood gates. 60 nurses a day. Every piece of testing equipment was disposable. I watched about 40K go right down the drain, when it could have easily cost 1/3 of that. Was I happy that my wife and daughter got first class care? Yes. But that is why the system is what it is. THE INSURANCE COMPANIES AND THE HOSPITALS. They work hand and hand, and that is why the system is bloated. Because they act as if it costs 60K when it doesn't. They justify their costs to keep the flood gates of cash flowing in. EVERYONE KNOWS THIS.

    It's all a scam. So my point is. If you run on a platform of "healthcare reform" and promise to provide "every american" with healthcare, the LEAST you could do is know the system. Know what the problem is, and reform it. Obamacare is NOTHING. Zero. Zilch.... And so, the prices went up even more....

    It's just like the banks. Sure, bail them out with a few billion, BUT DONT FIX THE PROBLEM!!!!!!!

    I am just saying bro, I have seen this sh** first hand. I have been on the side of a young person who cant afford it, to a working adult who pays entirely too much for NOTHING.

    This is america. And it's broken, and to say that the current administration has done ANYTHING to improve the REAL problems is just a lie.

    They know who is to blame. Big insurance. Period. And they are walking hand in hand together. So again, its just crooked government screwing everything up in different sectors. And to say otherwise, as MIS would say "How does that koolaid taste?"

    Again, both sides suck, but at least the GOP is a wolf in wolfs clothing. The Obama admin has been a wolf in sheep's clothing, promising things to us all and never delivering when they knew they couldn't from jump street. At least we knew the intentions of the GOP regardless of our opinions on it.
     
  8. seldom seen

    seldom seen Well-Known Member

    Aug 21, 2012
    here's what I don't get.. I'm not a finance/econ/mortgage/numbers guy. But I am that guy zach mentioned that works for my living but wouldn't qualify for sh!t, with minimal disposable income.

    But how the fark did the housing market get to be the way it is. My grandparents came here with nothing...seems like for them and my parent's generation, if you worked hard you could afford a house, even if you were working a run of the mill blue collar job.

    And another thing that gets my goat, look at the cost of ****ing college. It's ridiculous, and we're getting raped. These institutions that pose as guardians of knowledge and higher ideals are nothing more than for-profit businesses.

    Random, but now I feel better.
     
  9. Tlokein

    Tlokein Well-Known Member

    Oct 12, 2012
    If everyone is pissed off and hates both sides, what's it going to take for all the libertarians out there (myself included) to get the average Joe on board and kick the Dems and Reps to the curb?

    Money...lots and lots of money. How much in resources will it take to get that critical mass of people involved in the libertarian party so that it becomes a force that simply cannot be ignored? And if it reached that point how do we avoid it being taken over/infiltrated the same way that the dems and reps have been?

    This, IMHO, is the only way to fix things...
     
  10. MichaelJR

    MichaelJR Well-Known Member

    941
    May 4, 2014
    Coming from someone in the healthcare industry, concerning O-care, "you ain't seen nothing yet". Think quality of healthcare is down already? Wait until you see the primary shortage you'll all be feeling in a few years. Med school is becoming more accessible, namely due to the lack of incentive the future holds for it. Financially, our practice insurance policies are essentially taking up half of our salary now. It's no longer a road into upper echelons of the financial bracket. There's plenty of nurses making more than primaries. 12 years of study only to barely break 6 figures, and have enough red tape to keep scotch in business, it's not worth it. BU med lowered gpa requirements to 3.6.

    The ramifications of o care go far beyond your now exponentially higher premiums and deductibles. Good luck with elective surgery in a few years. Ask a Canadian what happens when you need a knee op.

    Socialized healthcare lol. Oh the irony. Welcome to the world of dr/nurse shortages and 15 year old imaging machines.
     
  11. zach619

    zach619 Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2009
    Because libertarians were a great thing 10 years ago. I, by definition, am one. It's a simple idea really: a free-market, laissez-faire capitalism (no government interference in the economy).... This does NOT work for liberals. The free market part and government interference will never enter the main stream enough for liberals. Because it directly conflicts with everything they have been doing lately. Healthcare. Banks. Economy. Welfare. Handouts.

    And here is the honest truth: I would say 75% of registered republicans are actually libertarian, because they could care less about gay marriage, and all the liberal social issues, but they drawn the line at the government intervention. They realize that siding with the libertarians brings them too far left, when in reality, that is really what they are....

    Libertarians = people who work for a living and don't want uncle sam handing out their hard earned money. To me, that is a HUGE portion of this country... But when you mix in all the BS agendas and platforms that everyone is running on, you HAVE to pick a side....

    And no one wants to be on the losing team. The libs will just never get enough backing to WIN. And people know that. It was like Miami heat fans.... They aren't even fans, but they know a winner when they see one and it's easier to sleep at night "THINKING" that you actually got their way.
     
  12. zach619

    zach619 Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2009
    Couldn't agree more. Tip of the iceberg.
     
  13. juliaep

    juliaep Well-Known Member

    280
    Aug 18, 2011
    Libertarians don't want uncle sam involved in their lives until gas prices get high, then the feds have to do something. Or, there's an ebola outbreak and the CDC isn't functioning well enough. Or, why hasn't the NIH found a cure. When I asked the a republican ambassador who had served in Iraq why we invaded Iraq. He said the problem was that the Bush administration wouldn't listen to the formal government institutions that warned him that an invasion would be a bad idea. In other words, he ignored government, listened to his arrogant and ignorant advisors and sank our economy and gave us ISIS. So the big "anti-government" is all good and macho until **** hits the fan and things need fixing.
     
  14. zach619

    zach619 Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2009
    Gotta disagree with you here. Not even $5 years ago, we were paying $4.50 for gas in CA, and the world kept spinning. Who cares?

    And as for the war in Iraq, you got ONE part of that right. Bush did listen to his THOUSANDS of advisers who were fully educated on the subject, who explicitly mapped out a plan of attack to "take a strong hold in oil country"... Plain and simple.

    Here was a plan in summation: Invade Iraq under "false pretenses" but while doing so, systematically install a democracy, as well as a fully functioning capitalist economy, all while funnelling BILLIONS and BILLIONS of dollar into the private sector there, that just so happens to be all American Based companies.... I.E. Funnel Billions of dollars to ourselves, setup shop, guarantee the contracts, install McDonalds, American Media, American Banks, Oil exports... The whole Nine... Pretty simple concept. Only, late in GW's run, he met opposition, the slapped all the companies on the wrist for basically turning Iraq into the wild west, then Obama took out all the troops and basically reversed everything that was going into action....

    And, NOW you have ISIS. Had we continued our as$backwards plan, we would have Billions in revenue over there, a strong hold on the oil field, our own american based exporters. Heavily taxed, portions of that would go right back into Iraq's economy. Iraqi people have jobs, freedom and no-one chopping off heads.....

    It's a tough pill to swallow, but that is the truth. That was the plan, had we just let it happen, we would NOT be dealing with the issues we are now. Period. It was a plan waiting to be executed for many years. 9/11, fear mongering and Saddam just finally gave the greenlight to "Operation, Move a US strong hold into the dead center of oil country" and 10-15 years later, reap the benefits.....

    The left and right have no differences on the CDC and Ebola. That isn't the issue....

    The libertarians have a simple theory: When the banks failed, they should have been left for dead. A proper, more responsible system of lending would have grown from it. Instead, we put a bandaid on a gunshot wound and called it "progress".... When institutions fail, you let them die. Period. When the american auto industry failed, let it die. More progressive, responsible businesses would have come from this... Sure, if the banks failed, or the auto industry, people would have lost jobs. THEY DID ANYWAY. It is a short term solution, when in the grand scheme of things on makes it worse. Wells Fargo and BOA and everyone else lended money they didn't have and instead of letting them plummit, we give them more money. Then they just pay a Million more debt collectors, and call centers and all these things to COLLECT money that does not belong to them. Its a joke to me. In summation, if you gave me money that was not yours, and you fail, what right to you have to come collect it back?

    This is the fundamental disagreement in this country... Too Big Too Fail. But nothing is too big to fail.
     
  15. zach619

    zach619 Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2009
    Libs have no issue with the CDC and government operations. It's when the government starts bailing out the PRIVATE sector that people don't like. I mean, am I the only one with a problem with the Senate wasting 10s of millions of dollars in tax payers money, investigating Barry Freaking Bonds and the steroids in Baseball? I mean, talk about government intervention... That is the sh** that people are sick of. The government interfering and bailing out institutions when it is NOT to the benefit of the american people.... What Obama did with America is far, far worse than what Bush was trying to do in Iraq. At least well all ultimately would have benefited here in the states from the GOP ops.

    Now, hidden in my own healthcare bills, I just end up picking up the tab for 6 other people, they just don't put that in the fine print.

    Chilbirth costs 60K because you are paying for 4 other babies that were born with no accountability and no one to pay for it..... It's all just hidden in there. And that is the problem, that the current administration has no plans to change that. IT IS CALLED SOCIALISM, and it simply DOES NOT WORK. Period.
     
  16. HARDCORESHARTHUFFER-RI

    HARDCORESHARTHUFFER-RI Well-Known Member

    Sep 17, 2013

    This is patently false spoken by someone without a clue
    ...'avoid foreign entanglements' says it all
    (oil) empire building always backfires. always.
     
  17. nwash

    nwash Active Member

    27
    Jul 5, 2009
    [video=youtube_share;xIraCchPDhk]http://youtu.be/xIraCchPDhk[/video]
     
  18. sbx

    sbx Well-Known Member

    977
    Mar 21, 2010
    Libertarians are so funny, I mean, I believe some pretty far out stuff too, but Libertarians all seem convinced that one day regular people are going to be convinced of the true way, and then I guess like vote in a full slate of Libertarian candidates or something and then we can all live in free market paradise. It's so very religious.
     
  19. sbx

    sbx Well-Known Member

    977
    Mar 21, 2010
    You should try to make that argument to people living in Iraq.
     
  20. seldom seen

    seldom seen Well-Known Member

    Aug 21, 2012
    Have you heard the Good News?