When are people going to wake up?

Discussion in 'Mid Atlantic' started by shark-hunter, Nov 5, 2012.

  1. snobowin

    snobowin Well-Known Member

    49
    Sep 5, 2009
    If you couldn't get the insurance supplied by the US Gov. a lot less people would build so close to the ocean. The Fed actually makes it more attractive to build on the beach by supplying the insurance. Keep the restrictive laws out. You can't legislate against everything. The beach replinishment projects do more to ruin surf.
     
  2. super fish

    super fish Well-Known Member

    Sep 2, 2008
    i am sure you may have read over this, but i also included a new drainage system. im pretty sure the year after year of pumping sand back onto the beach has done nothing. atleast the seawall will prevent the sand from being sucked out from underneathe the houses.

    fact being no one is going to move off the houses. just like new orleans is still going to be a very densely populated city despite katrina. merely telling people to relocate is rubbish, because they are not going to do it.

    instead of just criticizing, Weber, what do you have as an idea?
     

  3. super fish

    super fish Well-Known Member

    Sep 2, 2008
    thats because so many states make money off the tourism season. it would be difficult to built the town inland, then have a bridge leading only to state parks on the beach. there would be no boardwalk, amusement parks, ect ect on the inside that would attract the same amount of people as legitimate coastal towns. salisbury, md is not the same as ocean city, md.
     
  4. motivated2surf

    motivated2surf Well-Known Member

    102
    Dec 10, 2009
    I agree that FEMA should stay out of it. I live in a coastal town that was affected and I had flooding in my house. I believe that donations and charity groups will amass enough money to help people without the federal govt giving away tax dollars. If we follow that method, we have to also stop with food stamps, welfare and especial section 8 housing. I work my ass off and I'm not asking for any federal help but I see tons of people in my industry come in without jobs who can qualify for a free $2,000 for rental assitance. They get that free money and don't even attempt to get jobs. Illegals also get this if they have a child born here because of the stupid birthright law. If you are ending one form of giving away tax dollars, don't be a hypocrite. It needs to end for all social programs or at least be revised that you have to have some form of job. Also, unemployment should run out for everyone who is too good for other jobs. I'm sick of all my tax payer dollars going to lazy people who are always waiting for a govt handout.
     
  5. WEBER

    WEBER Member

    6
    Sep 20, 2012
    I wasn't criticizing your idea. It's an observation that I have made, that in this instance a simple seawall didn't help...
     
  6. super fish

    super fish Well-Known Member

    Sep 2, 2008
    here's my observation: they need a better seawall
     
  7. nynj

    nynj Well-Known Member

    Jul 27, 2012
    I aggree that federal $ should not go to illegals... But FEMA should not stay out of it. People will need their help. Just because some people get $ that do not deserve it, does not mean that people that do deserve it should not get it... My house flooded last year from Irene and insurance did not even come close to covering the cost of all the damage. If we did not get FEMA $ we would have been in a lot of trouble.
    Charity groups will raise a ton of $. But they will not be paying for everyone to rebuild their homes.
     
  8. gnarlytubage

    gnarlytubage Active Member

    42
    Mar 23, 2012
    sea walls are actually worse for ocean beaches then youd think. they speed up the process of erosion. instead of waves breaking on sandbars offshore when there is no sea wall, after a few years when one is built they would eventually be breaking right into the sea wall causing more of a threat. when you put up a sea wall it inhibits the beach of supplying itself with sand after a storm from a dune and eventually the beach will disappear bringing the ocean closer to homes and the sea wall. this also happens when you construct homes on beaches.
     
  9. super fish

    super fish Well-Known Member

    Sep 2, 2008
    good info, point accepted
     
  10. njerseysurf

    njerseysurf Member

    12
    Oct 29, 2012
    While I agree that rezoning is something that should happen for our own personal protection, I don't know if we should be reacting so quickly to this one storm. By and large this could possibly be the strongest storm to ever hit the northeast. Sandy is an outlier, it was so much stronger and damaging than any storm I have ever seen. Most houses there are prepared for moderate flooding, what is what is practical to prepare for. In a perfect world we'd prepare ourselves completely for another Sandy or worse, but I don't think people are going to be able to be convinced to prepare themselves for a repeat of a storm that happened once in the past generation.

    And not only that, but there is the concept of eminent domain. Imagine the cost to the government to have to pay people and banks who actually own the properties to give up their land. We can't just take the land away from people, even if it is for their own good.
     
  11. DawnPatrol321

    DawnPatrol321 Well-Known Member

    Mar 6, 2012
    Wasn't Sandy a Category 1?
     
  12. nynj

    nynj Well-Known Member

    Jul 27, 2012
    It was a Cat 1. But it was the size of the storm and the duration that make it the worst storm to hit the North East. It wasn't like we had 140 mph winds, but we had 85 mph for a day and a half... We've had stronger winds hit the NE in the past, but never for scu a long period of time
     
  13. hal

    hal Member

    8
    Oct 29, 2012
    The ocean has been rising .14 inches per year since the early 90's.
    This is a fact.
    In the last 20 years the ocean had risen nearly 3 inches.

    I am sure I will live to see Montauk completely destroyed. I watched Sandy take out 15-40' of cliffs.

    In terms of sheer destruction though, the wind, rain, and a few inches of rising sea is negligible. For now the real problem seems to be rising water temperature. This creates big storms, with big storm surges.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2012
  14. andrewk529

    andrewk529 Well-Known Member

    261
    Sep 3, 2010
    motivated2surf- I fully agree with you, which is why I find it hard to believe that people who continue to deny that our climate is changing will build in precarious locations.These people are the first to ask for the Federal government to rush in after a predicted disaster. If you want to smoke cigarettes great, but when you develop lung cancer don't expect me to pay your medical bills. The same logic could be applied to the Jersey shore. Science is clear that our oceans are rising and our climate is changing. Feel free to build along the coast. But when the next hurricane hits next year, don't beg for the Feds to waste more $ on ignorance or stupidity.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2012
  15. ScorchieLeWave

    ScorchieLeWave Well-Known Member

    95
    Nov 15, 2010
    Great idea - move everything back!

    Yeah, I could see the Hard Rock Cafe from Atlantic City in Vineland or Millville, New Jersey - probably the best thing that ever happened to those towns! I can see the sign now: Bob's Grill of Estell Manor welcomes you to a fine dining experience! Mack'n'Mancos of Maurice River. I can walk out of Heritage Surf and Sport on 8th st. in Mays Landing and dine at Randazzo's in Milmay. Or gamble at the Trump Taj Mahal on Egg Harbor pier!

    Man, we're not thinkin' small here - we're gonna need some serious logs from the pine barrens to build the f---in piers to float it up for the next Noreaster's short-period slop to move it all for us!

    But when it's done? I can pick up a new used board at Surfer's Supplies, catch a wave around 55th street and get beach it at Park Place.

    Let's get started!
    :cool:
     
  16. McLovin

    McLovin Well-Known Member

    985
    Jun 27, 2010
    What the OP is saying makes sense, but it's useless to preach "we never should have..." at this point. The communities along the beaches are here to stay. What we can do is minimize the development, and find a ways to mitigate the damage as much as we can to what is already there.
     
  17. dreadhead

    dreadhead Well-Known Member

    46
    Mar 2, 2010
    Out of who's pockets do you propose this money come from to ask people to move their homes back from the ocean? Although beach replenishment is not good for us surfers, if if wasn't done, then the beach would erode into the ocean. That 1000 feet that you propose for rezoning, would eventually become less and less until the barrier island is too thin to push back and "rezone" again.
     
  18. dreadhead

    dreadhead Well-Known Member

    46
    Mar 2, 2010
    While I understand your rationale, most of these coastal towns have been built for years and years, since way before you and I were born. And I don't know for sure, but most of these graphs and data about the rising waters and storm systems, have come from studies conducted long after these towns were built. There is no retroactive way to rebuild these towns. And I haven't heard one person come on this forum and whine about they're home or where they chose to live. Most people know the risk of where they live, but the reward is more worth it for them. Consider yourself fortunate that this storm didn't hit you as hard as it did others. And as for your cig smoking reference.. with obamacare, you will be paying for others' lung cancer. If anyone sounds ignorant, its you for hating on where people choose to live.
     
  19. shark-hunter

    shark-hunter Well-Known Member

    Apr 29, 2012
    You're also paying for someone to be saved by the police. Should only people who carry police insurance be saved? What about a fire? Should the fireman just stand outside and watch while you burn to death if you didn't pay your insurance. We take care of convicted felons and give them health care. Basic healthcare is something that should be a right as a citizen and paid for with taxes just like medicare. That's what evey other modern nation has. Hope Obama wins. We pay for it anyway when they go to the emergency room. The whole argument by the right is idiotic. Hell Nixon loved the idea of universal healthcare and mitt romney designed it in Mass! It was the basis for obamacare. Healthcare is basic public safety Anyway, that's off topic.

    "


    Oh and as far as building sea walls mr superfish. I find it incredibly strange that a surfer would want something that would basically end surfing and destroy all the beaches and beauty that come with it. Lets just take down this site. No reason to have it if you build a non stop sea wall for every town. The ocean is a wild place. If you don't like that your property might be flooded, don't live anywhere near it. Plenty of land far inland. It's like living by a river and asking the river be completely diverted and taken away. Why not just not build near a river in the first place. You either enjoy the ocean and take a risk by living near it. Or don't live anywhere near it. That being said. My original point stands. Oceans are rising and we should redefine where oceanfront land starts.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2012
  20. dreadhead

    dreadhead Well-Known Member

    46
    Mar 2, 2010
    What point are you trying to make? I was stating that AndrewK is misinformed if he thinks that he won't pay for someone's lung cancer. What are you saying about the police and firemen? I think your point got lost somewhere in your rambling. Universal healthcare is a great idea, but obamacare is no where near perfect, just a step in the right direction.