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  1. #131
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Green Room
    Quote Originally Posted by Zansurf View Post
    Wow, that is genius you can make it look like i said something i didn't that's awesome, yet you still have no intelligent rebuttal. I'll give you one more shot, to say something that makes sense. bama 08'

    haha, you must admit the joke was pretty funny. I second JMD. We've already tried to break it down for you with easy analogies etc. but no one cares. That's the thing about politics, you have your stance and it is almost impossible to get anyone to switch. It really all comes back to pride.

    I watch the market all day long and I would say that I know quite a bit about the economy. I know that if Obama does what he says he wants to do, we are in for very difficult times ahead. I'm not saying that when McCain gets into office he will fix everything but right now is not time to raise taxes on anyone.

    McCain is heading in the right direction by giving tax cuts to large corporations. Think about it, the corporations getting the tax cut hire more people who pay income taxes into the system. The products of their goods or services don't go up and they don't more their production facility oversees!

    Obama will raise taxes and instead of doing what Clinton did and pay down the deficit he will give your hard earned money to people who don't "feel" like working and fund the billions or trillion dollars worth of programs he plans.

    It all comes down to one thing. This country was not founded on those principals! Have you ever read the constitution? Obama does not believe the constitution should be upheld! If you work hard and put the time in, then your hard work will pay off. Why should we work hard so that someone who is alright with taking handouts sits home and watches Maury Povich all day and has no intention on ever making a living for himself? Why would they? The government will take care of them through our tax dollars!

  2. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by Db2k5 View Post
    People are upperclass because they went out and became that way. They didn't party thier way through high school and flunk out of college. Liberals are quick to want everything to be fair. Guess what, life isn't fair GET OVER IT. Grow up, you sound like a 4 year old. Remember, we are given life liberty and the PURSUIT of happiness, we aren't garunteed happiness. We are garunteed that we are able to go out and get whatever we want. Nothing in this world is free, and you IGNORANT liberals asking for a handout all the time and wanting things to be fair sounds like a 13 year old girl. Just because you work a **** job, and are lazy doesn't mean that people should have to give you money because you can't get out of your own way. On one hand, people ***** about government spending, then they want the government to give them free everything, healthcare, schooling, food, daycare, the next thing you know, you idiots are going to be asking for a damn car. Grow up.

    To the rational people out there, who aren't total MEATBALLS, sorry for my rant.
    It isn't quite so cut and dry. Being lower class or upper class does not necessarily correlate with ambition, effort and reward - opportunity for people from the lower echelons of society have many hurdles to overcome in order to significantly improve their "class status" but it is not impossible and there is a lot more opportunity in the USA to improve one's status then in other nations. On the other hand there are ample examples of the wealthly classes sustaining their entitlements through no special efforts of their own, but simply living off the wealth created by prior generations, and many laws have been written to support this opportunity. This nation's (USA) middle class has every opportunity to sustain its place, lose it or improve upon it although it has become more of a challenge during the past decade.

    To the poster: Do you live "on the grid" or "off the grid?" If you are on the grid then maybe refrain from pointing fingers at others.

  3. #133
    Quote Originally Posted by jbird View Post

    You don't get it. If we pull out now, we will have to go right back over there in another 10 years. Remember desert storm? There is a reason we are back in iraq.
    Do you remember the history of the Middle East? Indochina? The Balkans? The Crusades? Ten years is a mere snapshot in history.

  4. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by wallysurfr View Post
    It's pretty obvious that everything started becoming over inflated during the Clinton administration, the same president who lifted the regulations on the banks and FORCED the banks to lend to people who CAN"T afford a house. That is what caused the environment for this type of CORRECTION (not crisis).
    It really is not so obvious. Inflation was rather bad during the Carter administration due to the emergence of a strong oil cartel. Before that we had wage & price controls for around 3 years under the Nixon administration after which inflation bounced upward to heights nearly as high as the Carter/oil inflation ceiling. Also, equating the hi-tech bubble with the housing bubble is akin to comparing apples and oranges due to the breadth and depth of those markets and the degree of people's (and institutional) wealth that it represents.

    Moreover, the statement on bank regulations and loans is simply incorrect and the pools of loans made to people from the lower-middle class group was a very small proportion of the riskly subprime loans made and remade into highly risky repackaged instruments, also known as pyramid schemes.

  5. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by wallysurfr View Post
    The reason "Mr. Roboto" moves his arms that way is because they have been broken multiple times while being tortured when he was a prisoner of war, defending this country, our rights and our freedoms. So we can go surfing whenever we want on a $600 piece of foam without even thinking twice about it.
    It is a bit of a stretch to say the Vietnam War was a war defending our country, rights and freedoms... and our ability to buy a $600 piece of foam. Ditto the domino theory used as a key argument for this war - the Vietnamese Nationalists won the war but the nearby countries did not become communist. To the contrary, that region of the world collectively has thrived.

    Hey, I don't wish ill upon anyone, but you are also talking about the greatness and heroics of a man who lost 4 airplanes and is a gambler by nature. He rolled the dice and took a chance. I'd rather not see him roll the dice and risk our entire nation.

  6. #136
    Quote Originally Posted by wallysurfr View Post
    no, this is an open forum and we have talked about surfing so if you don't like it then don't read it.

    Kelly Slater, the best surfer (and possibly the best athlete) to ever live is voting McCain. Need I say more??
    Kelly Slater should spread his wealth and his abilities!!!

    P.S. Best athlete to ever live? Well, yeah, you do sorta have to live to ever become an athlete! Still a bit of a stretch... but, he is very accomplished.

  7. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by wallysurfr View Post
    no, this is an open forum and we have talked about surfing so if you don't like it then don't read it.

    It's a proven fact, if Obama tried to get a job with the CIA, FBI or even as a civilian within the federal government, he would be denied because of his links with the people he has surorunded himself by. As someone with a secret level security clearance, I must say, this is the biggest red flag of them all!
    This is a bogus assertion. Hell, a large number of the neo-conservatives that served int he Bush administration were freaking lefties before they became NEO-cons. As an aside, someone with a national security clearance could lose it by going around and touting it and posting a big red flag, "target me."

  8. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Zansurf View Post
    I'm gonna revert back to my statement that it's hard to change something with so much precedent. The president has nothing to do with pork barrel spending.
    The president has a lot of influence over pork barrel spending. The power of the veto is very powerful. It is also standard course in politics for the president to negotiate with congress over pork and presidents certainly lard up the budgets sent to congress.

  9. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by Db2k5 View Post
    Remember Viet Nam. I don't care how long we stay there, as soon as we leave it will revert back to chaos until another dictator or religious zealot takes over. That's the way it has been for thousand of years and we will never change that ideology.
    Sadam Hussein was an ugly person. But it is rather amazing that under Sadam's regime that women had more freedom, there were more religious freedoms, and that you could buy a decent Iraqi-produced beer. Not to mention that Al-Qaeda was a threat to a secular, Baathist regime. It remains to be seen to what extent Iraq moves away from being a secular nation to a theocracy.

  10. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by aka pumpmaster View Post
    Actually its more like this:

    "The hate for the country has no party is all based on the jealousy of our freedoms and rights and our wealth...including our freedoms and rights to vote for whomever we want."

    Especially in the muslim countries. Do some research on womens rights and the husband/wife dynamic in muslim areas. Muslim men are terrified of womens rights since that totally undermines their authority. So the preach hatred for the west (of which the US is the leader) as a way to keep those ideas from springing up.
    The USA is widely admired throughout the world. Most countries and peoples wish to emulate our form of government and freedom. In speaking of "our culture wars" however, it is interesting to note that a lot has changed in the USA during the past 40 to 60 years... it wasn't so long ago that women and minorities lacked many, many freedoms. But, we as a people have always had hope because of our great public statements of policy in the Declaration of Independence, Constitution and its Amendments, and the Emancipation Proclamation.